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“U.S. 801K Plans — double the returns from 401Ks!”

There’s a new teaser going around from a Stansberry newsletter, this time it’s from the 12% Letter by Tom Dyson, and it’s teasing us about a secret retirement plan they call the 801K. They’ve got a special report to send you called How to build a $1,000,000 Retirement with “U.S. 801(k) Plans” … and all you need to do to find out what these 801K plans are is to try a subscription for $99.

So there are two parts to this tease, the way I see it — there’s the actual “801K” concept, and then there are eight individual companies that provide these plans, which Dyson thinks are the best ones to buy.

First, the idea of the 801K:

“These companies encouraged the direct investment by paying out unusually high dividends and designed programs that automatically reinvested the profits. This ensured that ordinary Americans like you and me could start out small, with as little as $25, and quickly accumulate thousands of dollars in savings, without ever investing another penny.”

“But don’t ask your broker or financial advisor about “U.S. 801(k) Plans.” They will try to push you instead into a mutual fund that returns, at best, 10% a year. Remember, brokers can’t collect big fees and commissions with “U.S. 801(k) Plans” because you buy shares directly from the company.”

“Perhaps this is why the government restricts the advertisements of these opportunities. If they didn’t, some brokers might actually go out of business! Like I said, you’re not likely to hear about “U.S. 801(k) Plans” any place else.”

So, you may have figured this out on your own, but 801K plans are simply Dividend Reinvestment Programs (DRIPs). This is a program whereby companies — usually big, stable ones — sell stock directly to shareholders with an agreement for a regular ongoing investment and the reinvestment of all dividends. You invest a set amount, usually every month, not unlike with a mutual fund investment program, and the share price doesn’t matter because they’ll issue partial shares.

Some companies charge a fee for this, some do not, and some even offer a discount for purchase via reinvested dividends … but it is indeed a direct relationship with the company that doesn’t involve a traditional stockbroker. Services like Sharebuilder.com also do this, so you can initiated a DRIP plan even for companies that don’t offer them directly, but they charge either a small commission or a monthly fee.

There is plenty of good basic info on DRIPs out there — including from the Moneypaper, the Motley Fool and others. Most companies require you to be an owner of at least one share listed in your name already, some don’t or will help you to get that share, or there are some “single share” services that will help you to easily buy and get a certificate for a single share. This “single share” business is probably the biggest impediment to DRIP adoption, aside from the fact that you have to have separate plans set up with each company unless you want to join a club or pay for a service that does it for you (and really, it looks like fees for that negate much of the advantage of the DRIP for many stocks).

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But several “801K” companies were teased in this email, too — what are they? More than half of the S&P 500 offer these plans, as do many other companies, so I’m not certain that the clues given here will be enough to smoke out the company names … but we’ll try. Here’s what I know about the first two, I’ll try to get to the other six shortly:

“U.S. 801(k) Plan” Company #1 – This company is a fast-growing restaurant chain. It’s been in business for more than 30 years and operates in more than 20 different countries (and counting). In fact, it’s raised dividends every year but one since 1976, which are rising at more than 30% per year – almost twice as fast as the stock price.”

I thought this might be Wendy’s (WEN), but it hasn’t quite raised dividends every year. The 20+ countries, “more than 30 years” history and the DRIP plan and the rate of increase in share price could, arguably, fit.

Brinker (EAT) also fits in some areas — they’re in about 23 countries, but haven’t payed a consistent or rising dividend. Most of the other big restaurant chains are either way too big (even Burger King is in 65+ countries), completely North America-based (only a couple foreign locations), or don’t pay dividends, or, and this cuts most of them out, haven’t been around for 30 years.

But, strange as it seems, I’m pretty certain that this one is actually McDonald’s (MCD)

I know Tom Dyson likes McDonald’s as an income play — he previously teased the stock as The World’s #1 Dividend Machine — so I imagine he was being sneaky, it could well be that McDonald’s actually operates restaurants in more than 20 countries, since most of their restaurants (70%+ internationally) are actually franchisor-operated. The other stuff — company history, dividend history, all matches well. It was at the nadir for this company, in 2002, that they cut their dividend for the first time since 1976, and it has since grown significantly, including a $1 dividend back in November. The DRIP info for McDonald’s is here.

“U.S. 801(k) Plan” Company#2 – This New Mexico-based banking company holds $42.5 billion in high quality assets and has delivered consistent dividend income every year for the past 14 years. It currently pays a 10.10% dividend.”

This one is definitely Thornburg Mortgage (TMA) — DRIP plan info here.

Thornburg is a mortgage REIT that specializes in Jumbo adjustable rate mortgages — the theory is that because they’re dealing with big mortgages, the rich people that owe them money are less likely to default than are subprime borrowers. I don’t know whether or not that’s true, but pretty much all the mortgage-related companies are being tarred by the same brush right now, so if you think TMA stands out as better than its compatriots now might be a fine time to look into it.

One nice thing about TMA is that, because they focus on adjustable rate mortgages, they should theoretically be less susceptible to interest rate risk — assuming, of course, that their spread doesn’t go negative, which is always possible in a world where the yield curve can invert (they borrow money, then lend it in the form of mortgages, and they need their ARMs to pay off more than they have to spend to continue borrowing the money).

So … those are the first two candidates for your 801K plan in case you’re interested in DRIP investing. I’ll try to cover the other six as soon as I can … or you can beat me to the punch and tell us all the sleuthed solutions to these over in the Gumshoe Forum.

Want to keep up with the Gumshoe? Click here to subscribe now — free email alerts.

This writeup is a bit old, you can find an updated look at the 801k ads here.

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rhett
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rhett
August 22, 2007 10:02 pm

Mr. Shriber! Shouldn’t it be an “802K” if in fact the reference was to a doubling of a “401k”. Duh.
Rhett

Prevalent Entertainment
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Prevalent Entertainment
September 1, 2007 1:18 pm

If someone can respond to my following question – it would be much appreciated:

How can Tom Dyson claim that the “801K” would earn twice as much as a 401K – isn’t the point of most 401k’s that the company matches there employee’s contribution dollar per doller, or sometimes .75 cents on the dollar. How can a company’s DRIP earn as much if they are not matching your contributions like your employer’s 401k?

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Anonymous
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Anonymous
November 6, 2007 8:30 pm

Well if it is TMA the stock is off 60% recently. Not such a great place to put a large part of your retirement.

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Anonymous
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Anonymous
November 9, 2007 7:26 pm

Does anyone know if Enron had DRIPs? If so they would be a definate model to watch out for!

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Satish
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Satish
January 23, 2008 8:48 am

How can I get into this DRIP investing or 801(K) plans? I want to have a systematic monthly contribution of say, $100. Please advise

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heidi
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heidi
July 20, 2020 2:34 pm
Reply to  Satish

Check with Computershare. They do a lot of DRIP.

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Charles Cullens
Guest
January 25, 2008 12:46 pm

Do you sell 801K investments?

Jerry Kindall
Guest
February 13, 2008 9:18 pm

Prevalent Entertainment asks –> How can Tom Dyson claim that the “801K” would earn twice as much as a 401K – isn’t the point of most 401k’s that the company matches there employee’s contribution dollar per doller, or sometimes .75 cents on the dollar.

Most of the 401(k) plans I personally have had through my employers do not match anywhere near 100% of employee contributions. The one I am currently participating in matches 50% of the first 3% of salary contributed. The one at my previous employer did no matching at all! So if your employer matches 100%, my advice is to do whatever you can to hold on to that job.

That aside, I still don’t see what’s so wonderful about DRIPs since they don’t appear to be tax-advantaged in any meaningful way. You have to pay tax on the dividends even though they get reinvested, for example.

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NewInvestor
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NewInvestor
February 25, 2008 4:00 pm

I’m a recent college grad who recently started working so this 801k would be a good investment for me. How exactly do I get started? Any advice would help.

bsabin
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bsabin
February 27, 2008 6:54 pm

I work for the McLane Company for 15 years now.
Our 401k has just matched out at 2 to 1.
They actually took last years earnings and matched that 2 to 1 also….that was an extra $5,000 into my 401k plan.
I am wondering if it is possible to actually make a descent monthly income from 801k’s

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G
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G
March 2, 2008 11:03 pm

Sorry this is not a more meaningful comment but let’s make sure everyone knows there is no such thing as an 801k – Stansberry & Assoc made up the term. They make up terms all of the time. Their 801k is everyone else’s DRiPs (Dividend Reinvestment Plans). Personally, I find it demeaning that they take fairly well known investing concepts (like covered calls) and literally make up names for them (California Overnight Dividends?!?) as if they somehow discovered something brand new or previously kept secret. This makes me believe that their customer base is composed of new and/or naive investors.

By the way, within the last few days, they have changed the name of “California Overnight Dividends” to “Transfer Dividends” but kept the exact same copy, including the blatant lie: “One of Jeff’s secrets for making Californians rich is a proprietary income technique we call the “Transfer Dividend.”

Proprietary? PROPRIETARY??? Since when is writing a covered call proprietary? What some people won’t do for a buck. Or 199 bucks, in this case.

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brenda
brenda
March 4, 2008 12:38 pm

Thanks G — it’s true, the covered call stuff has been going out under both “California Overnight Dividend” and “Transfer Dividend” for the last few months. I’ve put out some notes on both, FYI:
http://www.stockgumshoe.com/2007/09/california-overnight-dividend.html
http://www.stockgumshoe.com/2008/01/jeff-clarks-transfer-dividends.html

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brenda
brenda
March 4, 2008 12:39 pm

And bsabin, the idea of the “801k,” if we want to persist in calling DRIP/DSPP plans by that name, is generally not to get income, but to build your capital through low cost dividend reinvestment. Much more of a slow wealth building exercise than an income strategy.

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jason
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jason
March 12, 2008 5:11 pm

the last of the 6 companies is Westshore terminals.

True12%
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True12%
March 12, 2008 11:19 pm

I don’t know about all the investment that’s been marketed here, but I’ve been getting 12% returns on a monthly check for a few years now and never miss a payment yet. It’s a corporate guaranteed commercial REIT notes, 9% double insured through a $60billion dollar insurance company. e-mail me if you’re interested at helloed@gmail.com

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W. Page Hill
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March 29, 2008 1:35 pm

Folks, I am 84, fully invested in equities, and have been for the past few years since I discovered Investors Business Daily….or IBD….the research is all done for you….with graphs, and all the stats you can digest…NYSE stocks are grouped by industry….evern the WSJ doesn`t do this….stocks are rated from 1 to 99 which is the best….Subs is about $300 a year but it is to be seen FREE at your public library… or you can sub it online cheap, or 1 or 2 days a week..it aint a newspaper ……it is a textbook for successful investors….try it, you`ll like it..

UK investor
Guest
UK investor
March 31, 2008 4:02 am

Hello, can someone advise if I can invest in DRiPS based in UK? or is this something soley for US residents?

New to this
Guest
New to this
April 2, 2008 11:36 am

I have only recently become interested in investing and do not know where to begin. What is a good way for someone with basic knowledge and limited funds to get started?

Investing for five months now
Guest
Investing for five months now
April 5, 2008 7:50 am

In response to “New to this”, I was in the same boat as you back in December 2007. I had decided that the only way someone could have become a “dot com millionaire” was to open up a trading account and fund it.

I ended up opening up a Scottrade account with a minimum $500 investment and bought two stocks that were recommended in a stock picking membership that I had signed up for. But I only had $675 invested and that wasn’t very exciting.

I’ve been with my current company for almost eight years now and had previously been with Best Buy for eight years before I graduated from college. I decided to rollover the $25K that I had in my Best Buy 401(k) into a Rollover IRA through Scottrade and didn’t have to pay any penalties or a set up fee to do that.

Once my Scottrade IRA account was funded, I signed up for two or three other stock picking newsletters in order to get a full spectrum of picks and chose what I believe to be the best investments for my limited resources. With the market going crazy right now, my $25K is down to about $23K now, but I’m invested in many companies for long term investing, so I am trying to be patient.

But then I’ve been hearing a lot about investing in gold and silver, but I don’t really have any money to invest in that. However, I spoke to my current company’s 401(k) plan administrator and she informed me that there was an option for a Segregated Investment Account where I could still be in the company’s 401(k) plan, but I could move a percentage of my money into that account and then get into the specific stocks that I wanted my money in. I filled out the paperwork for that a few weeks ago and I’m apparently the first person to ever fill out that form, so it’s taking them extra long to figure out how to set it up for me. 🙂

Once that account is set up and I am invested in the stocks that I want to be in, I am going to move $10K of my now $23K in my Scottrade IRA account into a gold/silver IRA fund.

I think I was always freaked out about stock investing, because I assumed there were a lot of tax penalties when you bought and sold stocks. Now I know there’s a 35% capital gains tax if you sell a stock that you’ve held for less than a year and a 15% capital gains tax if you sell a stock that you’ve held for over a year, and no capital gains tax if you buy/sell stocks in an IRA account until you eventually withdraw your money, usually upon retirement.

So I’m learning, much like you need to if you have “only recently become interested in investing.” I would recommend signing up for some stock picking newsletters to get into the mindset of how investors think.

I had signed up for The Insider Code (for WAY too much money) to learn about foreign currency trading and received 10 DVDs and a year’s membership. But I’ve since decided that I don’t have the patience to sit through two of those DVDs, much less all of them, to learn what I need to know to have the membership make sense.

I’ve also purchased memberships for The Takeover Trader, Agora Financial’s Penny Stock Fortunes, Agora Financial’s Outstanding Investments, Agora Financial’s Strategic Short Report, and just recently, The Motley Fool’s Hidden Gems.

Most of my initial stock picks were from Penny Stock Fortunes and I wasn’t that impressed with their selections’ abilities to give positive returns in a down market. Outstanding Investments seemed to me to be the best of the bunch so far, at least when you compare the performance of their picks since they chose them.

I found this website, because I too received the 801(k) thing in the mail yesterday for the first time and was all set to call them this morning to pay the $49.50 that they are asking for a one-year membership. That seems like a fairly reasonable price for their research, even though someone listed their company picks at the top of this page. I just think it’s important to be exposed to something like the Strategic Short Report so I can also learn the mindset of selling stocks short. I haven’t quite wrapped my head around that completely YET, but the best way to learn is to start small, learn all aspects of trading in the market, don’t be afraid to make mistakes, and not worry about becoming a millionaire overnight. That’s not realistic, not matter what these marketing people tell you to get you to sign up for their newsletters.

But you know what? You COULD become a millionaire overnight, but that’s 100% impossible if you don’t set up an account and purchase some stocks recommended by people way smarter and more experienced at this than you are. You’re also not going to win $100,000,000 in the lottery if you don’t buy at least one Powerball number a month, right?

I don’t know if I’ve purchased the best stock picking memberships that are available, but I’m in the game now. Not anyone on my team at work knows anything about stock investing, and they are all asking how my stocks are doing. So far, I haven’t been impressed, but it’s been exciting to log in every day to check their performance.

I had invested in LBIX based on a Penny Stock Fortunes recommendation when I first signed up for them and got in WAY lower than they had a few months earlier. By the next month, they decided to sell that stock for a loss, but I decided to stay in. I had decided to set my sell stop at $1.85, which would have meant I would have made $1,000 on that stock, but it went up to $1.84 and then TANKED!! It went all the way down to 95 cents per share and I ended up getting out at a $1,000 loss after it went back up a bit. That was my first stock sell and that taught me not to be too greedy to hit a $1,000 gain on every stock, since I might never get there. But I was one penny away! One penny!! That’s very frustrating. But now I know the sectors that I want to avoid and no longer make quick decisions on whether to buy or sell a stock.

So in summary, I am new to this too, but am learning and am investing. This weekend, you should decide if you have at least $500 to open up a Scottrade account (or any others, I like their $7/trade commission) and fund it with at least $1,000, or if you want to roll over an old 401(k) plan into the Scottrade account, or if you have a current 401(k) and your company will allow you to set up a Segregated Investment Account through it like I am trying to do. Or you could request the free gold investors guide through Lear Financial Gold Investments by calling 800-474-4259 like I did a few weeks ago. They are the company that I am contemplating investing in a $10K gold/silver IRA, but they have an option on there for a $2,500 investment as well and you can either keep the gold/silver in your possession or have them hold it for you. As the dollar continues to decline rapidly and most stocks tumble, gas prices and gold/silver prices will skyrocket. If I had more money, I would get into as much real gold and silver as possible, not so much in gold and silver stocks (though I am invested in one gold stock and a few mining companies, since they are relatively inexpensive per share and I wanted to be invested in a handful of stocks with my $25K and not just one really expensive stock).

I hope everyone that reads this realizes that I’m not trying to hawk any particular companies, but for someone new to this it really helps to at least know what someone else did or is doing. 🙂

I should probably end this now.

Good luck investing, “New to this”!

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Investing for five months now
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Investing for five months now
April 5, 2008 8:14 am

Holy cats! I just looked at the TMA stock. It went from $12.40 on February 27, 2008, to an all-time low of 69 cents on March 10, 2008. If you had invested $10,000 in that stock on February 27th, you would have lost $9,443 in 12 days. No thanks!

But I am still curious to read up on the research in the “801(k)” report. I’m going to sleep on this and check out the performance of the other picks before I part with my $49.50 though! This has gone from high urgency to low priority now…

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Mike S.
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Mike S.
April 8, 2008 11:47 am

I listened to this Stansbury paper and bought Japanese REITS through Everbank over a year ago and it has done nothing!! He said that real estate in Japan was about to explode after so many depressed years. I get my principal back at the very least if the Japanese index declines or doesn’t move forward. I wont be taking his advice again. I think this guys just pulls alot of these ideas out of his butt and works sweetheart deals with certain coin dealers, banks and other co-conspirators.

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