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written by reader The Antioxidant Paradox & the Goldilocks Principle

More "Just Right" Common Sense From Doc Gumshoe on Salt, Antioxidants, Blood Pressure and Obesity

[ed. note: We’ve been privileged to share with you some “non investment” commentary here from Michael Jorrin, a longtime medical writer who we like to call “Doc Gumshoe” — today he’s got a new piece for us that should help us think skeptically about yet more of the “easy solution” promises people make about health, usually when they’re trying to sell you the latest hot supplement or drug … and, as always, we need to remind you that the opinions from Doc Gumshoe are his own, we’ve done no more than a bit of light editing to prepare his piece for you today. Enjoy!]

Drink your pomegranate juice and eat your blueberries! They’re antioxidants, and antioxidants are good for you, because they combat free radicals (whatever those are) and free radicals are truly evil, because they cause all manner of diseases and are the underlying causes of aging, and if we could eliminate the free radicals, we could live a really long time.

That’s the Received Wisdom, and I won’t argue with it, because there’s certainly an element of truth there. How large or important that element of truth is remains to be seen. Let’s take this catechism one bit at a time.

Free Radicals: What Are They, Anyway?

First, what are free radicals? They are not bomb-throwers who have evaded prison, but small ionized chemical entities that are avid to combine with whatever they can latch on to. Consider saltpeter, chemical name potassium nitrate, chemical formula KNO3… Saltpeter is used as a food preservative, particularly in cured meats, and supposedly was put into the food of boys in boarding school, soldiers, and other young libidinous males in order to curb their natural instincts. When potassium nitrate enters solution, such as the human bloodstream, it immediately ionizes, meaning that the potassium part and the nitrate part swim around independently. The potassium ion has an extra electron in its outer shell, so it is K+, and the nitrate part is missing that outer electron, so it is NO3 –. The NO3 – ion is a free radical, and it seeks to combine with other entities from which it can grab that missing electron.

Saltpeter is just a single example of the kinds of substances that we’re exposed to that can create free radicals. All kinds of substances can lead to free radical formation – anything that can release ionized oxygen, hydroxyl, hydrogen peroxide, or other oxidizing ions. The worst offender is cigarette smoke, and there are many more in our environment. In the process of swiping electrons, free radicals can affect and perhaps damage human cells, including their DNA. If the damaged cells merely perish, that’s no big deal – cells die all the time and are replaced by new, healthy cells. But if cellular DNA is damaged, the successor cells themselves may be damaged or even cancerous. That’s the chief threat posed by free radicals.

What Do These Wonderful Antioxidants Really Do?

Antioxidants counteract the effects of free radicals by offering themselves up as targets, sparing some of the human cells that the free radicals might otherwise have damaged. There are lots of antioxidants in the food we eat, not just pomegranates and blueberries and cherries and carrots. The question is, are these dietary antioxidants sufficient?

There are those who answer that question with a resounding “NO!!!” (Many of these folks are the makers and marketers of antioxidant supplements, so they may not be totally disinterested.) Whether this view is completely fact-based or not, it plays nicely into a common tendency, which is that if a bit of something is good for you, then more of that same something is probably even better for you. Advocates of antioxidant supplements point out that, while antioxidants in our food may have been sufficient in times past, we’re exposed to so many more free radicals than our ancestors were that we need supplemental antioxidants.

In the case of antioxidants, this is open to question, at the very least.

So, what are antioxidants? The antioxidant substances in those useful (and pretty good-tasting!) foods are flavonoids, carotenoids, polyphenols, and others. Carotenoids, especially beta-carotene, are precursors of vitamin A, and vitamins C, and E are themselves antioxidants.

Dietary Antioxidants vs Antioxidant Supplements

The evidence that dietary antioxidants help prevent disease is quite strong. For example, there was a large study in Sweden, which followed more than 30,000 women for more than 11 years. The total study population was divided into fifths, and the study found than the women who consumed the most antioxidants in their diet (the top fifth) had an incidence of heart failure that was about 60% of that in women who consumed the least antioxidants (the bottom fifth). Heart failure is a pretty good indicator of many health factors, since several factors contribute to heart failure – high blood pressure, elevated cholesterol, diabetes, and obesity.

However, when it comes to antioxidant supplements, quite a lot of the evidence points the other way. For example, a study in current smokers who were given beta-carotene supplements found that these appeared to increase rather than lower the incidence of lung cancer.

The vitamin E question is particularly complex. The antioxidant found in vitamin E supplements is alpha-tocopherol, while the vitamin E antioxidant found in food is gamma-tocopherol. Vitamin E in the diet may reduce the risk of heart disease and cancer. Not so with vitamin E supplements, perhaps because of the difference between the alpha- and gamma-tocopherol.

In fact, rather than being beneficial, antioxidant supplements may increase rather than decrease mortality.

The most convincing evidence comes from the Cochrane Collaboration, which is an international organization (28,000 contributors from 100 countries) that reviews clinical trial data from all over the world and scrupulously creates analyses that pool the data from multiple trials. Cochrane reviews are generally regarded as the gold standard.

Cochrane conducted a systematic review of studies evaluating the benefits of antioxidant supplements, including beta-carotene, vitamins A, C, E, and selenium. They reviewed 78 studies with 296,707 participants, and found that overall, antioxidant supplements significantly increased the risk of death. In the 56 trials that they evaluated as having the lowest risk of bias, antioxidant supplements increased the risk of death by about 4%. That may not sound like a huge increase in the risk, but when we consider that antioxidants are supposed to prevent disease and death, and the data tell us that that they do the contrary, that should give us pause. And, by the way, this was true for each of the individual antioxidant supplements included in the study.

Why This Apparent Contradiction?

What might account for this paradox? One possible mechanism is that, while it’s accepted that free radicals might trigger the mutations that initiate the growth of cancer, there is some evidence that free radicals also preferentially attack cancer cells rather than non-cancerous cells. So perhaps in a healthy person, reasonable amounts of antioxidants in the diet might reduce the number of newly mutated cancer cells. However, once cancer cells are present, (as in the study in smokers mentioned earlier), free-radicals might keep cancer growth in check, and antioxidants might stymie their mission.

So the question looms: what’s the right balance between free radicals and antioxidants? This is the Goldilocks Question: how much is Just Right? With regard to the free radicals versus antioxidants question, it seems to me that the Just Right option is plenty of dietary antioxidants, but go easy on the supplements.

It does appear that free radicals serve some essential function, and we don’t want to eliminate them from our bodies – nor can we, since some free radicals are actually created in our white blood cells (neutrophils and macrophages) and help to kill and scavenge bacteria, protecting us from some infections.

The Goldilocks Principle and the Search for Just Right

However, the Goldilocks Question applies to almost everything in our lives. Everybody, and I really mean everybody, knows from experience that we lowly humans are comfortable only in fairly narrow range of conditions. For example, our normal body temperature is 98.6° F (37.6° C). But if we climb into a bathtub that’s at 105° F, it feels really, really hot. And if it goes much below 95° F, we might run a bit more hot water to get it to feel just right, so that Goldilocks would be happy in the tub.

The same question can be asked of many other things – such as the Just Right amount of salt in our diets, our optimum weight range, how much alcohol should we consume, and on and on.

The Salt Question

The salt question has resurfaced fairly recently. For quite a long time, the doctrine of the health authorities (such as the U. S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention) was that most people should consume not more than 2,300 milligrams of salt per day, and that people at risk for heart disease should limit their salt consumption to not more than 1,500 milligrams per day. That’s not much salt – maybe a bit more than half a teaspoonful.

The reason for this edict is that salt (or, actually, sodium ions) tends to raise blood pressure, and high blood pressure, as we all know, leads to heart disease, diabetes, and strokes.

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But the CDC has changed its tune, based on research that has emerged since their recommendations, which they issued back in 2005. A committee convened by the CDC reviewed the current evidence and pronounced that there is no reason for anyone at all to try to limit their salt consumption to less than 2,300 milligrams per day, and pointed out that when salt consumption is pushed below that level, not only is there no benefit, but some people may begin to experience actual adverse consequences.

A common assumption is that if too much of something is bad for you, then the best thing is to have as little as possible. This is the reverse of the assumption that has been made about antioxidants, that if some is good, more is better. But the Goldilocks Principle holds that we have to look for the amount that is Just Right.

In the case of salt, we can point to a couple of studies. In one, conducted in Italy, two groups of patients with congestive heart failure were assigned to diets with different quantities of salt. One group consumed 2,760 milligrams per day, and the other consumed 1,840 milligrams per day. The patients that consumed the smaller amounts of salt in their diet had three times the number of hospital admissions and twice as many deaths as those that consumed the higher amounts of salt.

Another larger study followed nearly 30,000 patients with hypertension for nearly 5 years and tracked their salt consumption by analyzing urine samples. In that study, the risk of clinically important cardiac events, including deaths, was significantly higher at the two ends of the scale – patients consuming more than 7,000 mg per day and those consuming less than 3,000 per day. So, based on those data, the Just Right amount of salt is somewhere in between those two numbers.

I should mention here that the average sodium consumption in the US, and elsewhere for that matter, is about 3,400 milligrams per day. Is that too high? The American Heart Association still thinks so, in spite of the new CDC recommendations. A concern is that what lots of people will take from the new data is that salt just doesn’t matter, and they can use as much as they want. But that, too, is a violation of the Goldilocks Principle – what we’re looking for is the Just Right amount of salt.

(By the way, I might add here that the biggest users of salt in the American diet are not cooks in the home kitchen nor yet people who sprinkle it on at the dinner table, but salty packaged food products.)

None of this research denies the well-established link between excessive salt consumption and hypertension. What it points to is that low sodium levels have some clear harmful consequences – triglyceride levels rise and insulin resistance increases, with potential adverse cardiac consequences. We can’t judge salt consumption just on the basis of its effect on blood pressure.

When It Comes to Blood Pressure, Is There a Just Right Level?

Speaking of blood pressure, the Goldilocks Principle applies there as well. Blood pressure is carefully adjusted by many homeostatic responses so that mean arterial pressure is about 100 mm Hg. Mean arterial pressure is just what it sounds like – halfway between the pressure at the moment when the heart contracts to force blood into the arteries and when it relaxes to accept more blood from the veins. That pressure, 100 mm Hg, is about 13% higher than atmospheric pressure at sea level, which is 760 mm Hg. We need that relatively small degree of additional pressure to keep the blood circulating throughout the body.

However, supposing your blood pressure was only 10% higher than atmospheric pressure, say, a mean arterial pressure of about 75 mm Hg, which might translate to 100/50 mm Hg. That 50 mm Hg value for your diastolic blood pressure is a shade too low. You’re running a risk of keeling over in a faint, because your heart can’t pump blood into your brain.

Of course, as soon as you do keel over, your heart isn’t pumping blood against gravity so much, and you’ll come to pretty quickly, and if you didn’t come down too hard, you’re probably fine. But that tells you that the little 3% difference between just right and too low can be important.

How About Weight and Body Mass Index?

Wasn‘t it Wallis Simpson, the Duchess of Windsor, who said “You can’t be too rich or too thin?” I don’t know about too rich – I’ll let you know if I ever get there – but you can definitely be too thin. The term for being excessively thin is cachexia; a condition that is seen in such diseases as cancer and AIDS, but that may also occur in persons who are obsessed with losing weight, e.g., some fashion models. It’s a risky condition, and can be fatal.

Of course, at the other end of the spectrum, we all know about the risks of being too fat. But is there a Goldilocks Principle here, and what does it point to as a Just Right body mass index (BMI)? Well, there’s a range, of course, but some data points to a Just Right range that’s considerably higher than the Received Wisdom.

In case you’ve forgotten, the official BMI ranges are: below 18.5, underweight; 18.4 – 24.9, normal; 25.0 – 29.9, overweight; over 30.0, obese. Taking yours truly as an example, I am 6’ 3” and I weigh about 217 pounds, so my BMI is 27.1 – in the middle of the overweight category. If I weighed 180 pounds, my BMI would be 22.5 – normal. To be underweight, I would have to weigh about 140 pounds. I haven’t been that skinny since I was a sophomore in high school, and I was really, really skinny then.

However, there’s pretty convincing evidence that those BMI ranges are flat wrong. An analysis of 40 studies looked at BMI and calculated the risk for both overall mortality and cardiovascular mortality, compared with normal weight subjects, which for this study was defined as BMI 20 – 24.9. No surprise – very obese individuals, those with a BMI over 35, were at very high mortality risk – about 10% higher total mortality, and 88% higher cardiovascular mortality. But persons with BMI values below 20 were also at very high mortality risk – 37% higher total mortality (higher than the very obese!) and 45% higher cardiovascular mortality.

What about the overweight and the obese? The merely overweight were at the lowest risk for both total (13% lower) and cardiovascular mortality (12% lower). And the obese in the 30 – 34.9 BMI range were essentially at the same risk as the normal weight subjects.

So, based on that study, which, by the way, came out of the Mayo Clinic, and included data on more than a quarter of a million subjects, the healthiest weight range is what the BMI classifies as “overweight.” The authors of the study suggested that it might be time to scrap the BMI as a risk factor. Applying the Goldilocks Principle, a bit overweight might be Just Right.

Is There a Just Right Level for Cholesterol, or Is Lower Always Better?

As far as I know, no one yet has determined what the Just Right number is for cholesterol, in particular LDL-cholesterol.

First, a word about nomenclature: we hear all the time about the good cholesterol and the bad cholesterol. I fear that those terms are just the way some health professionals try to avoid confusing us, but I think those terms are themselves confusing. I need to make the point that there is only one cholesterol, a fairly simple substance that has the characteristic of being solid at body temperature, and therefore, cannot by itself be transported in the bloodstream.

So, in order to get where it needs to go, which is just about everywhere in our bodies, cholesterol is gathered up in little bundles called lipoproteins. Some of the lipoprotein cholesterol bundles are large and loose – these are the low density lipoprotein cholesterol bundles, or LDL-cholesterol, or sometimes just LDL for short. Some are smaller, neater, tighter bundles – high density lipoprotein cholesterol, or HDL-C for short. The LDL bundles are the ones that tend to deposit cholesterol in our arteries, causing no end of trouble, therefore bad cholesterol, while the smaller HDL bundles transport cholesterol back to the liver and to the bile ducts for excretion, therefore good cholesterol.

We know what too high LDL-cholesterol levels are: in an otherwise healthy person, a reading of 190 milligrams per deciliter is way too high, placing that person at risk for heart disease. In persons with LDL-C levels greater than 190 mg/dL, treatment with a cholesterol-lowering drug, generally a statin, is recommended. Depending on risk factors, LDL-C levels as low as 100 mg/dL can trigger drug treatment, and in patients with established coronary heart disease or the equivalent, an LDL-C goal below 70 mg/dL is recommended.

So far, as regards cholesterol (whether total cholesterol or LDL-cholesterol) what has not yet been determined is How Low Is Too Low. Common sense (as well as current understanding of the role of cholesterol in our physiology) tells us that there has to be a Too Low level. After all, cholesterol is present in most of our tissues and is an essential component of most hormones; we synthesize most of the cholesterol in our system (only about 20% at most of our cholesterol enters our bodies as cholesterol), so clearly we need it. We just don’t know what the Just Right amount is.

A New Cholesterol-Lowering Breakthrough? We’ll See.

However, current drug development, being pursued pedal to the metal by at least four pharma outfits (Amgen, Pfizer, Regeneron, and Sanofi) may lead to a better understanding of the Just Right level for LDL-cholesterol.

It has been known for quite some time that some individuals have surprisingly low LDL-C levels – some young people are going around with LDL-C levels of 50 mg/dL or even a bit lower. These low LDL-C levels are likely due to a combination of genetics and life-style factors, and we don’t know much about the total health status of these individuals, other than that they’re in good health at the time. Have there been studies to follow these folks for another 25 or 50 years? I fear not – why would there be? We don’t go out of our way to look for trouble.

Just recently, though, a couple of individuals have been identified whose LDL-C levels are incredibly low – about 15 mg/dL. Their low LDL-C appears to be due to an almost freakishly unlikely genetic factor. These persons inherited mutated versions of a gene, designated PCSK9, from both parents. The PCSK9 gene, when working normally, is part of the physiologic process that unpacks LDL-C bundles and repacks the extra cholesterol they contain into HDL-C bundles for eventual excretion. When the PCSK9 gene is defective, some people develop excessively high LDL-C levels, and, as a consequence, are at high risk for cardiovascular disease.

But the mutations that these individuals with the really low LDL-C levels, rather than making these genes defective, had apparently made the PCSK9 genes super-effective. So pharma immediately saw a colossal opportunity, and launched research projects to develop drugs that would mimic the effect of these mutated genes. The drugs they have come up with are biologic drugs, which is to say, not simple chemical molecules, but complex drugs called monoclonal antibodies that attempt to duplicate the action of human agents produced by the immune system. Amgen has completed at least one Phase II trial in about 400 subjects, and their drug, designated AMG145 has demonstrated success in lowering LDL-C to 50 mg/dL in some subjects enrolled in the trials.

That would be enough for any pharma to mount a really big fireworks display, since no current drug or drug combination has achieved anything comparable. A person with high LDL-C, say 160 mg/dL, might bring it down to something in the neighborhood of 100 mg/dL by using a high dose of a statin. So a drug that would reduce LDL-C to half that level would be a huge step forward – in controlling LDL-C, at least!

Why do I stick in that slightly negative comment? Because we do not know the long-term consequences of living with an LDL-C level that low. The studies so far have not looked at clinical benefit – only at the change in blood LDL-C levels. Now, to be fair, the experience with lowering LDL-C has been, up to now, that heart disease risk goes down at the same time, so it would be expected that the same relationship between lowering LDL-C and heart risk would continue to hold.

But until this is confirmed by clinical trials with actual, concrete health benefits as outcome measures, we won’t know. I say this because of the Goldilocks Principle, which seems to apply in all kinds of areas where we human beings interact with the world around us. We saw what happens with antioxidants, salt, and our body mass index. We can’t assume that because some antioxidants in our diet are a good thing, more and more antioxidants are better. We can’t assume that because too much salt in our diets is bad, we should reduce our salt intake to almost nothing. We can’t assume that you can’t be too thin (I don’t know about too rich!) Similarly, we can’t assume that there are no health consequences to lowering LDL-cholesterol to previously almost unheard of levels. We’ll have to wait until we see whether those new drugs really do decrease heart disease, and whether there’s a minimum LDL-C level below which people might develop hitherto unsuspected problems.

Goldilocks is still waiting for Just Right!

* * * * * * *
Doc Gumshoe looks forward to your comments, and, in particular, to any hints about topics that you’d like to hear more about. Remember that I am not a bona fide MD, but I do keep up with health news and medical literature and consider it from my naturally contrarian point of view. My best to all, Michael Jorrin

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Ray
Guest
Ray
July 22, 2013 6:49 pm

I have always been skeptical about cholesterol amounts because it is not how much is in the blood but how much is deposited to artery walls that matter.

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gary c
gary c
July 22, 2013 10:02 pm
Reply to  Ray

Thank you emory, Iam glad we have a chemist here. Wow, folks really butcher elementry chemistry.

emory Braswell
emory Braswell
July 22, 2013 7:01 pm

Though Mr. Jorrin is good with words, I’m afraid that he has difficulties with chemistry and math. I hesitate to correct a couple of errors which might throw a bad light on this otherwise well written article. But good writing must also be backed with good facts. One of your readers has picked up on the pressure problem and another on the charge on ions. To make it clearer, NO3- is a negatively charged particle, a negative ion (anion), and IS NOT a free radical. A free radical is a chemical group with an UNPAIRED electron, usually neutral in charge. Having an unpaired electron does not necessarily produce a charged particle ( ion) . An ion is a charged group, usually with electrons all paired.
The paragraphs on pressure make no physical or mathematical sense to me. The author also omits some facts (probably unwittingly) which might complicate the story he is telling. He makes use of the idea of common sense, which maybe OK as a first approximation in regular life, but in the world of science, is not always the best operating principle.
I am a retired physical chemist with forty years of academic research in biophysical chemistry at a major university, who reads Gumshoe in order to make up for many years of an academic salary.

MachineGhost
Member
MachineGhost
July 22, 2013 7:47 pm

Dig deeper. The term you’re looking for is hormesis.

The studies that showed an increase in bad outcomes were using synthetic analog vitamins, not natural vitamins, especially with beta-carotene and alpha tocopherol. No one with any awareness of safe supplementing would intentionally take synthetic analogs over natural state.

All cause mortality is lowest with total cholesterol around 220. For LDL it is around 133. The real issue is not cholesterol per se, but the oxidation of the endothelium and the LDL membrane (which is composed of tocopherols and carotenoids). The longer LDL stays in the blood, the more prone it will be to oxidization. Cholesterol-lowering drugs only address the oxidiation issue indirectly at huge cost of negative side effects. Raising HDL has no positive effect. Clue: take specific antioxidants shown to provide optimal protection.

The mainstream media or organizations like Cochrane simply don’t care about the rampant cronyism, corruption and retractions of published studies, hence the apparant flip-flopping. Once those variables are controlled for, much of the mainstream agenda withers away and the case for supplements/nutrition becomes much stronger.

And while its true that there are at least hundreds of unidentified phytochemicals in real food, the doses need to achieve specific health outcomes with currently identified phytochemicals are in most cases simply impractical without resorting to extracts sold as supplements. The difference between good health and optimal health is in the hormetic dose, whereas most people are in poor health from malnutrition. Current best practice is to eat real food and amplify with supplements. The recommendation of 5 servings a day of fruits and vegetables (14oz) was based on ORAC values of which has now been discarded as a useful measurement. I would view the target as more of a way to ingest a broad variety of phytochemicals.

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emory_braswell
emory_braswell
July 22, 2013 10:07 pm
Reply to  MachineGhost

Last remark: For some of the data quoted by both the writer and the commenters: Correlation is not necessarily causation.

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JOYOUS BURKART
Guest
JOYOUS BURKART
July 22, 2013 11:00 pm

My Dr. thinks I need 4 pills a day of Fish Oil……for high cholesterol……..now what do I do?
I take Lipitor and see on TV their are law suits…..saying Statins cause Diabetes…..
I do have Diabetes as well…….any ideas

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archives2001
archives2001
July 22, 2013 11:28 pm
Reply to  JOYOUS BURKART

Joyous:
Go to Jerry Mixon MD’s website…Here’s a link:
http://blogs23.longevitymedicalclinic.com/tag/diabetes/
He has several radio talks on his site that u can listen to.
“70% CURE..Now THAT’S a pretty BOLD statement but he certainly does have a great many
patients who can verify that I believe.
You can also listen to him live every Sat morning from 8 to 10 PDT, over the internet as well as phone him with your query.

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MachineGhost
Member
MachineGhost
July 23, 2013 4:46 pm
Reply to  JOYOUS BURKART

Fish oil is typically used for treating high triglycerides (VLDL). High tryglycerides is typically a sign of too much carbohydrates in the diet.

Statins work by forcing cholesterol to be cleared from the liver. As a result, the liver upregulates LDL receptor activity and it gets the cholesterol it needs by taking it from the bloodstream. Unfortunately, this leaves the rest of the organs in body, especially the brain, starved for cholesterol which is a critical substance necessary to life and optimal health. There are many negative side effects of statin use, but the most common is CoQ10 depletion and cumulative muscle damage. So at the very least if you buy into the use of statins, you must simultaneously take ubiquinol to protect your heart and energy levels.

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hipockets
July 22, 2013 11:13 pm

Hi, Doc

Great article. You must have written it with the Goldilocks principle in mind!

Please comment on:

1. Sea salt versus table salt.

2. How anti-cholesterol drugs (especially statins) work.

3. Is part of their function to, partially at least, cleanse the arteries of cholesterol deposits?

By the way, Lipitor (a generic form) did not reduce my cholesterol to a level my doctor found acceptable.. He added one pill of Zetia a day, which brought it down to an acceptable level. But since it costs me $1.10 per pill with insurance, I went looking for a “just right” alternative.. I found several anecdotal comments on the web that indicated that one pill every other day works just as well. It works for me – my cholesterol is still at an acceptable level.

$1.10 every other day is far from being “just right”, but it’s better. If blood tests weren’t so costly, I would try every third day.

Thanks for your articles.

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MachineGhost
Member
MachineGhost
July 23, 2013 4:57 pm
Reply to  hipockets

No, its not to cleanse the arteries of cholesterol deposits. Statins just lower LDL transport. Removing cholesterol would be the role of HDL transport and increasing HDL to do so actually increases mortality. That’s because cholesterol transport by LDL is a response to endothelium dysfunction; it acts a band-aid in other words. You must fix the underlying issue so that the plaques are no longer needed. In the rabbit studies used to prove orally-ingested cholesterol caused arterial plaques, such plaques were 100% stable and did not erupt and cause a blockage or heart attack. That may be because rabiits have the innate ability to produce Vitamin C in massive quantities which human beings do not.

I encourage everyone to view this pathway and the accompanying text so they become better informed as to what all the endless B.S. is really about: http://www.sabiosciences.com/pathway.php?sn=LDL_Oxidation_in_Atherogenesis

Pauling who advocated mega-dosing of Vitamin C died of prostate cancer at 93 years old (!!!). His grave error was in thinking one type of antioxidant was universally protectant against all causes of mortality. Prostate cancer is a hormonal issue which antioxidants do not address.

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packrateric
Member
July 23, 2013 1:03 am

Cholesterol lowering drugs are undoubtedly effective and here to stay but are not really getting at the root cause of cardiovascular disease. Although very thorough studies have been conducted and published by many researchers regarding the effectiveness of a plant based diet this avenue of therapy and prevention have not come to the attention of mainstream America .

Very affordable,effective,safe,non medication based treatment for heart disease,obesity,diabetes is as close as your grocery store.The plant based diet is very satsfying and calorie counting is unnecessary.

Do an Internet search for the work done by Dr. Esselstyne ,a cardiologist at The Cleveland clinic. a search for the term plant based diet will also lead you to his work.

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packrateric
Member
July 23, 2013 1:07 am

Addendum
This is not a fringe diet or a fad diet.the plant based diet is being used by no other than Bill Clinton and also used by triathlon athletes.

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archives2001
archives2001
July 23, 2013 7:20 am
Reply to  packrateric

Hundreds of thousands of Seventh Day Adventists and Loma Linda Univ
certainly substantiate this research Eric;.

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blackjack
blackjack
July 23, 2013 2:52 am

statin drugs were a huge benefit to big pharma
big pharma has poured billions into research and in shutting down health food shops and vitamin distributors that make claims about supplements
but its ok for big pharma to make outrageous claims
as the have the backing of FDA
and their checking methods are suspects as well
after all they did approve aspartame and we all know who benefited and what health effects that has on the human body
eat drink and be merry for tomorrow you might ………..

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archives2001
archives2001
July 23, 2013 7:32 am
Reply to  blackjack

Not to mention the 100,000 people killed in/by hospitals every year and that
certainly doesn’t include another 100,000 killed by prescription & otc drugs
These ‘revolving door shills’ collude with msm to finger the few who improperly
use herbs and supplements.
They think they have the general public sufficiently drugged for us to accept this swill;
And so far it appears they are correct.

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Tony
Guest
Tony
July 23, 2013 3:01 am

I invested in biotech stock CVM which is in stage 3. The stock has been tanking. I speculated on this stock after read seeking alpha articles, etc. Could you Travis or doc gumshoe give your opinion on this stock. Is their product even viable or have a market? I thought that it might be a good bet after Teva invested in them but I’m not so sure anymore.

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wiseword
Member
wiseword
July 23, 2013 3:29 pm

Is there any way we can please, please, get rid of “coronary heart” disease? I assume this is to differentiate it from — oh, let’s say “coronary kidney” disease or “renal heart” disease. To be perfectly clear perhaps we should have “coronary heart ticker big red Valentine thing” disease.

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topcat
Irregular
topcat
July 23, 2013 3:56 pm

A website that has helped me understand how my body works is http://www.sensiblehealth.com that provided info which allowed me an option to gallbladder removal many years ago. I still have my gallbladder and have used the tinctures off and on. I don’t take all the advice, but I know I do feel better when I followed more of it. Mostly, the information helped me better understand what our organs do for us in the processing of what we eat. GI =GO Thank you Doc , Travis & all who post knowledgeable comments for providing more truly beneficial information.

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Lorne
Irregular
Lorne
July 23, 2013 5:02 pm

Not surprised by BMI. BMI is a one size-fits all approach which doesn’t actually take into account people who might exercise with weights a lot and actually have high ratio because muscle is denser than fat for the same volume.

Regarding cholesterol, has anybody seen any good information on how much one can get their cholesterol down by diet and exercise and by how much. I got mine down about 20% in 3 months. Its not low enough yet but I would rather avoid drugs if the diet/exercise downward trend can continue. Found lots on what to eat and not eat but nothing on how much and how fast it takes to get cholesterol down with the right measures.

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packrateric
Member
July 24, 2013 12:42 am

To Lorne

Look into Plant based nutrition,
Papers on its efficacy published in American journal of Cardiology by Dr. CB Esselstyn.
They have also published in the lay press helpful guides.. His son wrote a book/guide “Engine 2 diet” a book about how a fire house went on this diet and the fire fighters lost 10lbs and significantly dropped cholesterol in 4 weeks.

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packrateric
Member
July 24, 2013 12:48 am
Reply to  packrateric

to L weiss
t
The term coronary heart disease is not redundant but refers to coronary arterial heart disease .The coronarys are the arterys to the heart. This differentiates it from say hypertensive heart disease or Rheumatic heart disease.

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packrateric
Member
July 24, 2013 12:51 am

PS some folks have been literally able to to get rid of the their cornonary artery disease by
a plant based nutrion approach.See the references mentioned above:)

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Bill Chenault
Guest
Bill Chenault
July 24, 2013 9:51 am

Interesting and well written article, though I was glad to see the my initial confusion over the positive vs. negative ions straightened out in the comments. I thought for a couple of minutes that I had forgotten the little chemistry I once knew.

Anyway, just trying to tie together the usual focus of these emails (making money, typically via stocks) with the medical subject matter – you mentioned Amgen (clinical trial of phase II drug AMG145) has a new cholesterol lowering drug. I know ISIS ( http://ir.isispharm.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=222170&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=1839488&highlight= ) has a triglyceride lowering drug in development (phase II trial results in the link, there is also a 30 minute or so web presentation on their site), plus an approved drug (Kynamro) for a particular rare form of genetically high cholesterol (homozygous familial hypercholesterolemia). They have ongoing studies to try to get Kynamro approved for cholesterol lowering for a wider group of patients. I am sure there are lots of other drugs from other companies as well.

Could the wonderfully knowledgeable and erudite Dr. Gumshoe put together a brief list of the companies he knows of, and any drug candidates they have in the Phase II, Phase III and / or just recently approved (say less than 6 months ago, so sales may not have fully ramped up yet) status, along with a couple of sentences on the drug target, and any thoughts about likelihood of eventual approval, and what drugs they might supplement, replace, or compete with if approved? Maybe limit it to one area, such as lipids or heart disease or something. If it is well received, perhaps another one later on Cancer fighting drugs, etc. Anyway, it would be a great way in your next article to let us know the ongoing progress of medical science, plus give us a chance to see what others think of our favorite biotech, and make sure we haven’t overlooked other stocks that might either compete with our favorites or beat them to market, etc. Obviously, the list doesn’t have to be 100% complete (probably not even possible), but if each reader finds out about a couple more potential competitors or potential treatments, we become more informed, and hopefully richer and healthier too.

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FarmGirl
Member
FarmGirl
July 24, 2013 3:40 pm

Diet and exercise are the best ways to lose weight. Belviq, a new drug from Arena Pharmaceuticals (NASDAQ: ARNA) depresses the appetite and helps people stay on a diet. It does not increase metabolism or “burn fat” but it is very effective in helping people change what and how much they eat. Phentermine does increase metabolism, and can be paired with Belviq. Gumshoe, have you seen any teasers for ARNA yet?

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Travis Johnson, Stock Gumshoe
July 24, 2013 4:09 pm
Reply to  FarmGirl

Haven’t seen ARNA touted since last year, which I covered here: http://stockgumshoe.com/reviews/money-map-report/announcement-pending-on-june-27-for-best-selling-drug-in-prescription-medicine-history/

That came three years after the first wave of newsletter bluster about ARNA, back when it was originally expected to get approval in 2009 — we even had newsletters from different publishers fighting over it in their teasers, pitching it as both a long and a short: http://stockgumshoe.com/2009/02/a-good-old-fashioned-newsletter-fight/

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A Doctor writes.....
Member
A Doctor writes.....
July 24, 2013 4:57 pm

As (another) physician, agree this article is well-written and more balanced than much of what one reads in the MSM on ‘health’. Would add a couple of things: the human body is incredibly susceptible to psycho-social influences. Happiness is as important as your cholesterol levels! Happy / positive people do not get sick a lot. When happy people do, perversely, get sick, they are a pleasure to treat and generally respond well to whatever treatment we physicians have/ offer/ prescribe. Unhappy / negative people get sick a lot. They are unpleasant to treat and have all sorts of complications and side- effects. The second is that there is no ‘medical’ field more full of mumbo-jumbo, pseudo-scientific claptrap, erroneus folklore and maddeningly impenetrable delusion than that of human ‘nutrition’. Witness the rise and rise of the most modern, most fashionable, most attention seeking, designer ‘disease’ : the food allergy. Problem is, some are quite genuine and potentially deadly, but many more are entirely in the mind. Fact is, the human body, like many other animals, can process a wide variety of foods and maintain excellent health. It just needs to be common- sense balanced, palatable, attractive, not too expensive and varied. The one thing we really have to watch in modern times is just too much of it. “The major difference between humans and animals is the ability and desire to take pills” is an incredibly profound statement.

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archives2001
archives2001
July 24, 2013 7:00 pm

Doc,
I appreciate your insight and comments.
You seem like a very pragmatic doc, willing to consider all facets before making up your mind: “Just the facts, Ma’am, just the facts…”
One aspect that seems to be getting little attention from mainstream medicine is the acid alkaline balance (homeostasis), but I note quite a few younger avant-garde dentists have jumped on board with their own treatment instead of just prescribing sea salt and baking soda which has worked for me and thousands of others thru the yrs to prevent caries and all sorts of oral issues.
If it applies so well to the teeth, then why shouldn’t it apply to the entire system
since the teeth are an important part of that system?

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MachineGhost
Member
MachineGhost
July 25, 2013 11:30 am
Reply to  archives2001

That’s because the body tightly regulates the blood’s pH and it does not vary at all except maybe in some cases of cancer where it is allegedly too acid.

So taking potassium bicarbonate or a water from an alkalizer, etc. will not survive the low pH stomach acid to “alkalize the body”. Magnesium, which is also in chlorophyll, is an alkalizing mineral and in fact you will find that to raise the alkalinity of water requires magnesium, chloride, sodium, calcium, etc.! So eat healthy and supplement with the minerals instead. There’s no doubt drinking alkaline water will help reduce acid on the teeth and I can attest to that; but it is a clumsy and expensive way to do so. Far better to use a proper, multi-step dental care regime.

If a high acid diet was really bad, then it should show up in or pre-agricultural ancestors who ate a high protein, high fat diet. Well, it is not evident from their bones or teeth. So just ignore the acid/alkaline issue as veganism propaganda as they are the ones that exploit it. Consider it a marker for macro-nutrient defenciency instead.

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archives2001
archives2001
July 25, 2013 11:22 pm
Reply to  MachineGhost

“That’s because the body tightly regulates the blood’s pH and it does not vary at all except maybe in some cases of cancer”

Au Contraire Machine Ghost…
https://www.google.com/search?q=disease+acidosis&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

And speaking of Linus Pauling, He and his institute have MUCH to say about
the acid alkaline balance:
Restoring proper acid-alcaline balance in San Francisco Bay Area
http://www.biotherapy-clinic.com/alkalize.html‎
… to a mineral deficiency.” Dr. Linus Pauling, winner of two Nobel Prizes. … Acidosis is the first step towards premature aging and accelerated oxidative stress.
Supplementary treatment of metabolic acidosis | How Diet Nutrition …
http://www.howdietnutrition.com/…/supplementary-treatment-of-metabolic-aci…‎
Mar 27, 2013 – There are several types of metabolic acidosis, including diabetic … and electrolytes that Linus Pauling Institute – increases your metabolism …
metabolic acidosis Archives | theblakestersxooma.com
theblakestersxooma.com/tag/metabolic-acidosis/‎
Aug 27, 2011 – Tagged with: blakester, Dr. Linus Pauling, focus up, free radicals, metabolic acidosis, The Problems with ASEA and Redox Signaling Molecules …
Dr. Linus Pauling Archives | theblakestersxooma.com
theblakestersxooma.com/tag/dr-linus-pauling/‎
Aug 27, 2011 – Tagged with: blakester, Dr. Linus Pauling, focus up, free radicals, metabolic acidosis, The Problems with ASEA and Redox Signaling Molecules …
Supplements For The Treatment Of Metabolic Acidosis …
http://www.livestrong.com/article/416183-supplements-for-the-t..‎
Metabolic acidosis occurs when too much acid accumulates in your body fluids. … dietary mineral and electrolyte, states the Linus Pauling Institute — increases …
acidosis | Drink Water Get Healthy
drinkwatergethealthy.wordpress.com/tag/acidosis/‎
Jan 9, 2013 – Posts about acidosis written by southernstylemarketing. … Dr. Linus Pauling Two-time Nobel Prize Winner. 3) Will increase the pH of your water …
Chronic low grade metabolic acidosis | ProHealth ME/CFS and …
forums.prohealth.com/forums/index.php?threads/chronic…acidosis…‎
Chronic low grade metabolic acidosis. Discussion in … And I wholeheartedly agree with the great Nobel Prize winner Linus Pauling. woofmom, May 13, 2008.

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MachineGhost
Member
MachineGhost
July 30, 2013 5:02 pm
Reply to  archives2001

I think you’re confusing various acidosis disorders with measuring the blood pH. The blood pH is tightly regulated and simply does not vary except in very extreme cases such as chronic diarrhea from loss of electrolytes. The dogma in alternative medicine about “alkalizing the blood” or “protein leeching calcium from the bones” has zero to flimsy scientific evidence backing it. All bark, no bite.

archives2001
archives2001
July 30, 2013 9:39 pm
Reply to  archives2001

MG, You state,
“I think you’re confusing various acidosis disorders with measuring the blood pH.”
Better do an update ‘Fact Check’ my friend.
Here’s what WP has to say and it’s quite comprehensive:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acidosis
Now PLEASE, go back and carefully review what the L Pauling institute has to say in their volumes of research that u seem to have rejected.
Other researchers like Drs Goldberg MD and Jonathan Wright MD have done considerable research on the subject as well:
http://www.burtongoldberg.com/page84.html

And please do a simple google search for “acid alkaline” “dental research” to
observe extensive research and application underway which seems to be several yrs ahead of mainstream medical research.

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MachineGhost
Member
MachineGhost
July 30, 2013 10:47 pm
Reply to  archives2001

I stand corrected in regards to the blood pH.

But what we’re really talking about here is dietary influencing the blood pH, not respiration or chi or metformin, etc., so read these:

https://chriskresser.com/the-ph-myth-part-1
https://chriskresser.com/the-acid-alkaline-myth-part-2

archives2001
archives2001
July 31, 2013 12:40 am
Reply to  archives2001

Kresser’s bio and introduction:
He seems to be well versed in alternative/complimentary medicine but his bio – credentials don’t compare with the research of a noted institute like Pauling and
MDs such as Jonathan Wright, Goldberg, and Jerry Mixon.
Wright (Tahoma Clinic) is sought out internationally as a top researcher & father of contemporary alternative and complimentary medicine.
And here’s what Dr Weil has to say:
http://www.drweil.com/drw/u/QAA400883/The-Acid-Alkaline-Diet-Eating-to-Protect-Bones.html
I do appreciated this statement that Kresser makes and thnx a lot for the references:
“In doing this research I discovered that many of the ideas and beliefs we hold about health in this society are myths. I began to see that even the most prestigious medical journals have become nothing more than sales brochures for the pharmaceutical industry. I saw massive conflicts of interest between drug companies, doctors and researchers everywhere I looked. I learned that errors in medical care are the third leading cause of death in this country each year.”
HE WHO PAYS THE PIPER, CALLS THE TUNE.
And these following statements he makes, also substantiate how our system is affected by the foods we eat:
” I want to acknowledge a couple things they get right. First, foods do leave behind acid or alkaline ash. The type of ‘ash’ is determined by the relative content of acid-forming components such as phosphate and sulfur, and alkalis such as calcium, magnesium, and potassium.”
“I don’t deny that many people have seen significant health improvements when switching to an alkaline diet, but there are many possible reasons for this not having to do with pH balance. Eating more fresh produce is rarely a bad idea, especially when it displaces nutrient poor processed foods. A person switching to an alkaline diet would significantly reduce their consumption of grains, which could cause dramatic health improvements for somebody with a leaky gut or gluten sensitivity. Dairy would also be minimized, which would help those with dairy sensitivities.”
And from my perspective, logic and anecdotal evidence trumps all in the case of dental caries… Sugar and acids are extremely deleterious to the teeth and mouth, which is perhaps one of the key reasons why dental research is in the forefront of
acid alkaline research application by recommending sea salt and bicarb of soda as the
best means to maintain a neutral or slightly alkaline oral environ.
I can personally attest to this since I suffered a MI (Widow Maker) ten yrs ago and
at the same time incurred 3 abscessed molars and a serious bladder infection.
All this gave me a ‘come to Jesus’ wake up call and started me on thousands
of hours of research into the cause – effect etiology of systemic inflammation:
https://www.google.com/search?q=imflammation+%22acid+alkaline+balance%22&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

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👍 94
archives2001
archives2001
July 31, 2013 1:33 am
Reply to  archives2001

Addendum:
I forgot to mention, by the time of my heart attack at the age of 64,
I had incurred over 50 carries and other oral issues. It was at that
point I began using the baking soda and sea salt instead of toothpaste.
I’ve had no further mouth problems since and I still have those molars
my dentist commanded needed to be pulled stat.

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MachineGhost
Member
MachineGhost
July 31, 2013 2:57 pm
Reply to  archives2001

Actually, the problem is not acid per se in the mouth, but bacteria. You’re old enough that you can probably remember the decades of propaganda about sugar and acids being harmful and to avoid them which didn’t do a darn thing to prevent increased cavities, gum disease, etc.. Well, technically acids are the poop and biofilm of harmful bacteria. It’s only within the past decade or so that the dentistry tune has begun to change to focus on bacteria.

Baking soda is actually too harsh on the enamel because it disrupts the protective biofilm of good bacteria. I recommend an interdependent, multi-step dental care regime that’s been clinically vetted in killing the nasty bugs while not destroying various mouth structures: http://www.drellie.com/pdfs/The-Kissing-System/Complete-Mouth-Care-System-Cliff-Notes-Version.pdf

Get the full book if you need scientific proof instead of anecdotal reviews. I substitute the third step with a tooth and gum multi-herbal extract. Am also looking for a natural replacement for step four.

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david clumpner
david clumpner
July 31, 2013 4:03 pm
Reply to  archives2001

MG:
“Baking soda is actually too harsh on the enamel because it disrupts the protective biofilm of good bacteria”
Baking soda and sea salt has worked extremely well for me in the past ten yrs ever since my systemic inflammation conditions of my mouth, heart, and bladder incidents occurring simultaneously.
Lots of research out now on how our teeth can cause MI as well as systemic inflammatory issues.
Here are a couple of links that further substantiate:
You may find them quite startling but again, all of this has worked for me!
Ramiel Nagel has several other youtube clips and a book that u may find of interest:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8hnmyBoUgE
Same for Dr Robt O Young:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUN0fGpyIQY

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PHD Chemist
Guest
PHD Chemist
July 24, 2013 5:24 pm

The nitrate ion is not considered a free radical because it is stable anion. It has zero tendency to react just like other stable anions; e.g. chloride, bromide, flouride, sulfate, etc.

Dave Rossin
Member
Dave Rossin
July 25, 2013 5:35 am

Good article. Well researched and interestingly written. The Goldilocks Principle might be applied to people exposed to low-level radiation. That means all of us. It comes from the Sun, space, rocks and periodic X-ray exposures. At these levels and 100 times larger, cell damage is recovered over time by natural growth of surrounding cells. That is why radiation exposure standards should take into account time periods of exposure. They used to, but current standards simply add up all man-made exposure regardless of its actual tiny magnitude. This is “justified” by a linear non-threshold theory (LNT) that has no basis in scientific fact and leads to meaningless calculations of “collective dose.” They are mainly used to get headlines, mislead politicians and lead to fiascos like evacuations of tens of thousands of people from their homes in the Fukushima region of japan.

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