What’s that “August 28 ICO” pitch from Martin Hutchinson about?

Checking out the introductory "will be bigger than bitcoin and ethereum" ad for Crypto Alert from Agora Financial

By Travis Johnson, Stock Gumshoe, August 15, 2017

“An entirely new digital currency will hit the net on August 28

“It will rapidly replace ALL current “crypto-currencies”… and then ring the funeral bell for the mighty U.S. dollar

“Profits on this new currency are completely uncapped (unlike Bitcoin)… and based on past modeling, I predict they’ll be 1,000 times higher than we’ve ever seen before

“Making this your ONE LAST chance to get in on the ground floor of the hottest market trend in more than 2,300 years… RIGHT NOW”

That’s the attention-getting promise from Martin Hutchinson’s pitch for his new Crypto Alert service with Louis Basenese, which is a fairly pricey ($3,000 one time fee, $199/yr maintenance fee) newsletter published by Agora Financial.

And I’ll warn you up front, I don’t know for sure which coin it is that Hutchinson is hinting at — though I’ll share a low-conviction guess with you after we roll through the clues.

The time is ripe for these kinds of pitches, of course, because we’ve seen cryptocurrencies skyrocket over the past year, even big ones like bitcoin and ethereum, and we’ve also gone from fewer than 100 cryptocurrencies a year ago to more than 1,000 now, with dozens more being launched each month as new developers try to get in on the frenzy or add something to the blockchain/altcurrency/cryptocurrency marketplace.

Hutchinson also claims credit as an expert on cryptocurrencies, partly as a result of the article he coauthored for the Cato Journal a couple years ago. He says that he “won’t bore you with all the technical details” of that article, perhaps partly because the article was entitled “Bitcoin Will Bite the Dust,” but I thought it was worth reading (and he has backtracked some from that assertion of late).

That article did wisely point out one of the problems of Bitcoin, the reliance on that network of miners to validate Bitcoin transactions, and the extent to which economies of scale (and an arms race in computing power) would pressure the system:

“Despite its success, the Bitcoin system is unsustainable due to a design flaw at the very heart of the system. The problem is that Bitcoin requires competition on the part of “bitcoin miners” who validate transactions blocks, but this competition is unsustainable in the long run because of economies of scale in the mining industry. Indeed, these economies of scale are so large that the bitcoin mining industry is a natural monopoly. Furthermore, there are signs that competition in this industry is already breaking down. Once that happens, the system will no longer be able to function as it hitherto has. Its key attractions (decentralization, absence of a single point of failure, and anonymity) will disappear; there will no longer be any reason for users to stay with it; and the system will collapse.”

And there’s some interesting info in the conclusions as well, here’s part of the sum-up about bitcoin:

“Even in the unlikely event that it survives into the medium run, we would still rate its longer-term chance of survival as zero. First, we should remember that a recurring theme in the history of innovation is that the pioneers rarely, if ever, survive. This is because early models are always flawed and later entrants are able to learn from the mistakes of their predecessors. There is no reason why Bitcoin should be an exception to this historical rule. The second reason is that in the very long run bitcoin would be uncompetitive against efficient closed-wall systems such as PayPal or COEPTIS, the successor to e-gold. Once the production of bitcoins becomes insignificant, then the Bitcoin system will entirely depend on transaction fees to cover its operational costs, and its fee levels would be higher than those of more traditional payment systems because of the need to maintain excess hashing and excess capacity to deter new entrants into the transaction validation business. Put differently, Bitcoin can never achieve the technical economic efficiency of competitors that can operate with a very small number of servers, or even just one. In the very long term, when there are no new bitcoins being produced to subsidize the validation process, the Bitcoin system will no longer be able to compete.20 Last but not least, there is still the problem that Bitcoin is not backed by anything.”

That doesn’t mean anything about the near-term value of an asset that is traded based almost entirely on sentiment and momentum, of course, and it doesn’t really give great insight into the immediate prognosis for any of the other cryptocurrencies — bitcoin was trading between $200-$250 at the time that article was published, during the doldrums following the first real run in bitcoin prices in the years previous (and many of the first wave of “me too” cryptocurrencies had already lost 99% of their value), and it recovered sharply over the following year and, as we now know, went almost parabolic in 2017 as the bitcoin price surged from $1,000 to $4,000.

Let’s get back to the ad…

“When you see teenage hackers with backward baseball caps start getting clued into the same exact tipping point as gray-beard economists with silk ties… and Silicon Valley venture capitalists… and Wall Street investment bankers…

“Even ordinary Americans like Jared Kenna (a beer brewer who made more than $30 million trading Bitcoin). Or Charlie Noble (who revealed to CNBC that a fellow Ethereum trader made a 300,000% gain in less than a minute).

“That’s when know that something must be about to happen.”

That scares the heck out of me, mostly because it’s the same thing that drove sentiment during the internet bubble in 1999 — and, frankly, that drives most bubbles: “We’re all making money because we’re all making money!” When a cab driver gives you stock tips about the next internet sensation in 1999, that’s scary… when the waitress talks up the twelve houses she bought with no money down in 2005, that’s frightening… and when the high school kid who mows your lawn tries to convince you to buy the latest initial coin offering for a new cryptocurrency in 2017, I can’t help but feel that same twinge of fear.

Sometimes, as we know, the “something” that “must be about to happen” is a big old slap in the face as reality hits all at once.

Reality might not hit, of course, or it it might not hit anytime soon, I don’t know — many of the pundits persist in predicting that the next debt ceiling showdown will drive the prices of cryptocurrencies higher, as arguably happened during the first bitcoin surge a few years back, but that’s clutching at a rational reason for things that have already increased by thousands of percent, in some cases, for no real reason. Maybe it will happen — the cryptocurrencies do tend to react to crises like gold does, at least recently (as in, they rose during North Korea fear last week, and fell during the return of North Korea complacency this week), so you can place your bets where you like regarding the next possible dollar crisis this Fall (or whatever the next crisis du jour might be).

What Hutchinson seems excited about here is the potential for this alt-currency market to become a “winner take all” arena… where, naturally, he’ll have chosen the winner:

“You’re talking about a toll-booth for every single transaction that happens, every single second, all around the world. And it’s all no sweat, because there are NO physical barriers whatsoever to one currency dominating ALL of it. And FAST….

“… the whole point of a currency is that it becomes the standard that all other transactions are measured by.

“Again, winner takes all.

“That’s why your grandchildren won’t use ‘dollars’ to describe a big score.

“No, they’ll use the name of the coin being issued in this historic ICO…

“How do you make the best investment opportunity of the 21st century 1,000 times better? Just add a few more zeroes…”

The big pitch is that bitcoin and ethereum have been huge winners, but that this next coin offering will supplant both of those and the US dollar and become a ridiculous profit-maker… more from Hutchinson:

“… what’s even more amazing here…

“Is that there are still so many more zeroes on the table, by getting in on this next big ICO.

“Remember, if I’m correct that this ultimate digital currency will replace not only Bitcoin and Ethereum, but also the U.S. dollar itself.”

He even includes a chart that indicates the total potential for this initial coin offering is the “total value of all physical currencies” … so we can’t fault him for a lack of ambition.

And, yes, he does include the stipulation that this probably won’t happen:

“So let’s be real – turning a few hundred bucks today into the sum of all the money in the world is not going to happen for you. You are not going to literally make a trillion dollars from this ICO trade.

“Obviously you’ll need to set your sights lower than that.

“All I’m trying to demonstrate is how BIG this revolution in the world’s currency use could become… because this theoretically could all happen over the long run.”

The big sum-up:

“Because in the long run, only ONE NEW CURRENCY will become the STANDARD. (Just like the dollar did in the 20th century.)

“My research convinces me it will be THIS one. And the thing is, when I say ‘long run’ here, I don’t mean a century.

“I’m talking months, or even weeks.

“I know, that’s extremely unlikely.

“But we’re talking about history here. And the one lesson we’ve learned from history, across thousands of years, is that things do not stay the same. And when they do change – it always happens much, much faster than conventional wisdom says it should.”

So what is the actual ICO that Hutchinson is talking about here? I can’t claim to be much of an expert on the intricacies of all the different cryptocurrencies (though I do own small chunks of bitcoin, ethereum and litecoin), but let’s see if he drops enough clues for us to throw some guesses on the table for you:

“In an uncapped ICO, the early investors buy as much as they want. And then in the weeks, months, and years after the ICO, further production of the coin is sensibly limited to avoid inflation.

“Which means if the coin is in high demand, its price will then go through the roof!

“That’s why I’ve been searching carefully over these past few years for an ICO with totally uncapped profits….”

OK, I guess that makes some sense. You want the ICO price to be low enough and the future coin generation to be low enough that you stand a better chance of making money. That’s just logic, though, and there isn’t any one rule about how you price an ICO (since, for most cryptocurrencies, there’s no “there” there — there’s nothing on which to base a valuation).

“Since Bitcoin hit the scene in 2009, digital currencies have been something like a Catch-22 for investors:

“The MORE reliable coins tended to have capped profits

“And the LESS reliable coins tended to have uncapped profits

“There just wasn’t a great choice for traders.

“Until now.

“… that all ends on August 28, when this new uncapped ICO takes off.

“Why I’m staking my entire career on this ONE digital coin… predicting that it will RAPIDLY replace both Bitcoin and the U.S. Dollar… and digging into my own wallet to make this effectively FREE for the first 199 readers who take me up on it today….

“I’m putting all of my chips down on ONE new coin, and declaring it the swift & final WINNER of the digital currency wars.”

OK, so that’s certainly a bold statement. Which is what you have to make if you’re trying to get someone to pony up $3,000 when they don’t know you from Adam. Any other clues?

“I don’t want to bore you with the specifics, but the way this entirely new kind of currency works is that it puts a tiny fragment of code on millions of computers all around the world.

“And each of those computers has a different fragment of the code.

“Put them all together, and the amount of computer muscle devoted to securing this system equates to more electric power than the entire states of Nebraska, Delaware, and New Hampshire use.

“More than 19.23 terawatt-hours in total.”

OK, as a non-expert that pretty much sounds like most of the other clues in the ad — like it could apply to almost any cryptocurrency, all of which (as far as I’ve seen) rely to some degree on a distributed network of computers verifying transactions and monitoring the security of the blockchain. That is, after all, the point of the blockchain, that you have a distributed system where security rests on so many people’s shoulders that it’s almost guaranteed.

More from Hutchinson:

“The strongest mathematical models in the world imply that it would be impossible for this new type of security algorithm to be broken.

“This makes the new digital currency in this Aug. 28 ICO more stable than the dollars in your pocket – where we’re one Janet Yellen ‘taper’ or Donald Trump ‘tweet’ away from total mayhem.”

And one more clue:

“… the technology behind this new ICO even allows for the creation of ‘smart contracts,’ so that free people can make business deals without any lawyers, or brokers, or bankers, or regulators involved whatsoever.”

That was a big part of the selling point of ethereum, that it was effectively more of a programming language than just a transactional blockchain-controlled currency and could incorporate smart contracts and all kinds of other useful tools… and lots of other coins or tokens or cryptocurrencies or whatever you want to call them offer this kind of function as well.

So does that get us any closer to our answer? Not really. The clues are all generic and could apply to pretty much any cryptocurrency, particularly since so many of the new ICOs are based on ethereum and have that blockchain’s access to smart contracts… and the limitation of time could be pointing to one of the dozen or so ICOs that have been announced or are underway as of the end of August, or to the need to inspire immediate action for possible newsletter subscribers in an artificial deadline, or a coin offering that is underway and might end as early as August 28 if there’s a lot of demand.

There are dozens of possible ICOs that could match these clues that are now open or will be open soon, you can browse them at places like ICO Alert or TokenMarket or CoinSchedule, though there are plenty of others that have slightly different data.

And I don’t see any sign of one that stands out in those lists, frankly. So… I’ll throw out a guess based on what I’ve read of Martin Hutchinson’s work over the years… my guess is that he’s pitching what he has often talked about wanting: a secure, possibly anonymous cryptocurrency that’s backed by gold, and there is one such service that’s currently in the “ICO” phase and has a fixed token price so won’t inflate away the gains with ICO overbidding, (though they don’t use the term ICO): OneGram.

OneGram could easily not be the one he’s actually recommending, of course, this is very much a guess — and this one is a bit atypical in the cryptocurrency world, partly because it has its own blockchain instead of being built on bitcoin or ethereum’s blockchain (most new coins are based on ethereum), but they do say that their blockchain is based on successful parts of bitcoin and other systems.

OneGram is essentially a way to buy expensive gold and get an uncertain cryptocurrency for your trouble — they indicate that each coin is backed by a gram of gold, and that you buy the coin with gold (using their own brokerage only, GoldGuard, and after adding a premium/fee of something like 10%). They say that they will finish the token sales when they hit their limit or in about 38 days, but at this point they’ve sold about 2/3 of the available tokens so they may well hit the limit around August 28, I have no idea.

I also don’t know anything about GoldGuard, or what other fees they might charge. The appeal here, as I understand it, is that they will try to turn this into a real cryptocurrency that is used for transactions, and that the transaction fee they charge (2% or so, presumably) will be rolled back into the asset base, adding marginally more gold to the value of each OneGram token over time. Assuming, of course, that there are a meaningful number of transactions.

And the promise, which is appealing, is that the downside is limited because of that gold backing — since they actually have the gold in a vault somewhere, the coins are not likely to trade for a lot less than the value of the gold they represent… so perhaps if gold goes up in value and a gram is worth twice as much in a year as it is today, your token will rise in value as well.

I can see the appeal of that, but I have no idea how the market will take it. The only real point in trading in these wild west cryptocurrencies, unless you want to make it your life’s work to really become an expert on all the underlying technology and pick winners and losers (I’m not qualified for that, perhaps you are), is that they might surge by 1,000% and reward you amply for the risk you’re taking… so will this seemingly lower-risk gold-backed currency end up rising less because the price of gold acts more as an anchor than a foundation… or will crazy cryptocoin traders bid it up regardless of the underlying gold value? You’d need a couple PhD’s in psychology to predict how it will play out, I expect, and even then you’re guessing.

OneGram is also, by the way, a project based in the Middle East and backed by some big investors there, with the focus of their launch as a transactional currency likely to be the various Gulf emirates… and the currency is designed to be Sharia compliant as a gold-backed investment, though I don’t really know whether all Muslim cryptocurrency investors are likely to draw the line at the same place OneGram has. I don’t know if that will make a difference or not in their effort to launch and gain some traction. OneGram’s website is here, should you wish to research it further, and it includes a typical (though quite short and detail-light) “whitepaper” descriptive commentary as well as a link to token sales, which go through Gold Guard.

So… that’s all the guesses I have for you on that front, I don’t see an obvious candidate for an ICO that’s currently being offered that has the potential to unseat bitcoin or ethereum, which are the established brands, (and the currencies by which many of those new currencies are valued), but I’m also pretty skeptical about the whole idea… I love the idea of the blockchain, it has the potential to be as powerful as the world wide web or email in terms of transformative technologies for the Internet, but I don’t see a way in which any current cryptocurrency holders really “own” that technology in a meaningful way, and it’s really a wild west R&D project — the only real world business that’s important in the world of cryptocurrencies right now is the business of creating and selling new cryptocurrencies.

Cryptocurrencies matter, and maybe they’ll be part of the solution of our constantly depreciating national currencies or the inflation explosions that destroy economies from time to time, but that doesn’t mean I can come up with a reasonable logical answer to the question “what should bitcoin (or ethereum, or any of the others) be worth today?”

And if I can’t at least guess at an answer to that question using a sharpie and a bar napkin, I’ve got no business putting much money at risk in it. Perhaps if you trust the OneGram folks and wade through the fees and think it will be worthwhile there’s some “value” underlying that token thanks the gold backing, but, well, on that front I’m just as happy owning an actual gold coin. I’ve held some cryptocurrencies for a few years, in relatively small amounts even after they’ve surged by 1,000% or so (they would make up about 3% of my equity portfolio if they were stocks), so I don’t think they’re pointless and I do think they’re worth following… I just can’t get past the fact that I can’t put a reasonable price on them, so that keeps me from getting my feet any wetter than they already are. I won’t be buying any OneGram, but perhaps I’ll pick up another gold coin.

Curmudgeonly? Dimwitted? Missing the boat? I’ve had much worse yelled at me across the cyberseas… what do you think about the cryptocurrencies? have a favorite new one that you think other folks should get excited about, or that you think Martin Hutchinson is peddling? Think they’re all junk? Love or hate your bitcoin or ethereum or ripple or steem or whatever? Let us know with a comment below.

P.S. Things have gotten crazy enough with the deluge of ICO’s that the SEC stepped in with a warning letter… and also clarified that these coins are generally classified as securities and shouldn’t be sold willy-nilly without regulation or oversight or licensing (OK, they used different words than that) — you might want to check out their letter here, beyond putting some worthwhile fright into the mind of potential speculators, which is healthy, it also gives a decent overview of the ICO world and explains some of the terms pretty well.


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445 Comments on "What’s that “August 28 ICO” pitch from Martin Hutchinson about?"

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thomashogan640
Irregular
12
thomashogan640

Utrust had its ico on the 28th

upok7
Member
0

I tried to open an account with onegram via goldguard and was blacklisted with a United States address. Substituting United Emerites ok though. But of course they would block my funds fr0m a US financial institution.

Moi
Guest
0
Moi

Did anyone heard about banker and ? It says it will be a strong crypto

texasboy
Irregular
0
texasboy

If cryptocurrency is such a great deal, why do you have to spend actual dollars, real money, to buy it? Sounds to me (the totally ignorant, uninformed one) like if you take actual dollars out of the equation, there is nothing of value there. Is it not “real” money that gives these “currencies” any value at all?

aqrobles
Guest
0
aqrobles

“Is it not “real” money that gives these “currencies” any value at all?”. No, it is demand. Bitcoin is bid up because people want it in exchange for dollars – and other cryptocurrencies.

thousand
Member
-1
thousand

My friends, 100% sure it is Chronologic, look at this:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2066734.msg20992623#msg20992623

https://sl.empiricus.com.br/cmp240817-rel/

If you don’t know Portuguese, please use google translator. Empiricus is Agora Brazilian Subsidiary. You can check it.

PNGento
Guest
0
PNGento

Really, 100% sure? Do you know what 100% means? Unless you have paid the $3000 to Agora, no way can you be anything more than a “best guesser”.

DannyC
Guest
0
DannyC

Someone paid the $3000 Agora fees and confirmed it to be Corian which ended its ICO on 28 Aug. I think Agora is trying to create an opportunity to gain more fees amidst the redhot crypto market. I doubt they know which one will be the next bitcoin.

alwayslooking
Irregular
40
alwayslooking
I just read the Corion.io White Paper and news articles, and I am not impressed by what they offer. If this the best Martin Hutchinson can do, then I am glad I did not subscribe to their new Crypto Alert newsletter. I think HelloGold and UTrust have much better long-term prospects for success than Corion. Would you rather have a Corion coin pegged to the inflated USD (which has dropped so much in value recently (see USD Index), or would you rather hold bitcoin or ETH, which have appreciated in value so much this year in relationship to the USD?… Read more »
alwayslooking
Irregular
40
alwayslooking

Who is this somebody who confirmed that Corion was the ICO being promoted by Agora? The Corion.io website stated they their ICO ended on 27 August. Agora’s ICO started on 28 August. And the Wall Street Daily newsletter authored by Lou Basenese on 28 August specifically mentioned a time-based crypto currency and Day Tokens. Using deductive reasoning, the only logical choice would be ChronoLogic, whose ICO is still open. See: https://chronologic.network/contribute/

PNGento
Guest
0
PNGento

Really…who exactly is it that you say paid the $3000 Agora fee? I say this is BS.

thousand
Member
-1
thousand
thousand
Member
-1
thousand

There is still 150 timemints available in Chronologic ICO started yesterday:

https://chronologic.network/contribute/

They sold almost everything in 24hs. They say US investors can participate after the DAY tokens goes to exchanges

David Schrader
Guest
0
David Schrader

I don’t get it. So did Basenese and company tell all the subscribers to lie and say they were non-USA residents? Wonder what the penalty is if they find out you are not? Doesn’t seem worth the risk, especially with a minimum of 5 ETH just to get in.

PNGento
Guest
0
PNGento

Exactly David Schrader. As such, can’t be Chrono.logic.

thousand
Member
-1
thousand
PNGento
Guest
0
PNGento

Ok, now I’m sold it is chrono logic. Wouldn’t have participated anyway…too rich for my blood. I will keep a watch out for when the day tokens hit the market, however.

alwayslooking
Irregular
40
alwayslooking

ChronoLogic ICO is closed already. Sold out in 36 hours.

gristinvest5
Irregular
49

I think they were telling them to purchase after the actual day coins go on the exchanges. I do think at some point you won’t even be able to get a alt address to even participate in the ICO’s in the US. It’s already on some of them but not many. The companies are trying to protect themselves by doing so from regulators, etc.

gumimat
Irregular
1
gumimat

Crypto Currency is the latest Ponzi Scheme. Early entrants will make money when the “shills” buy later. The “in” crowd is making a fortune. It is truly creating something out of nothing. There is absolutely no value if their is not higher demand. It is not money. If the power goes out, what do you have? It is not like gold or silver.

alwayslooking
Irregular
40
alwayslooking
The power is out in Houston now. What good is gold and silver if it is under six feet of water? The value of bitcoin is in the consensus opinion of millions of people that transactions are quick, cheap, secure, can be authenticated in a decentralized global network, and it takes three days of electricity for specialized computers to solve the mathematical algorithm which creates more bitcoins, up to a hard cap of 21 million coins. By the way, I also own gold and silver, but I need some cash flow today, which comes from trading the cryptos.
sundog88
Guest
0
sundog88

Yesterday was the FIRST day for Universa (August 28th) VERY well can be the one the article was talking about! Get IN the system if you want in the Pre-Ico OR if you want in for the ICO – NOTE: the pre-ico minimum is around 5 btc OR register and wait for the ICO – Have a Look – NEW link/button –
https://check.universa.io/-9xWtQH – PreIco will only last for a few days.

sundog88
Guest
0
sundog88

NOTE: 5 bitcoins – for PREico, that’s not in my budget on a “gamble” but I’m for sure going in the ICO (in about 60 days)

DannyC
Guest
0
DannyC

People who paid $3000 Agora fees were told that the confirmed one should be Corian which happened to end their ICO on 28 Aug. instead of starting on that date. Risking 5 btc for some unjustified touting recommendation sure isnt the way to invest. But going for the actual ICO in 60 days time need more cautious consideration as Universa seems unlikely to be the soughtafter ICO.

DannyC
Guest
0
DannyC

Hi there, i went into universa and registered my email, then got free 50mUTN. Then nothing happened. No reply or welcome email. Universa was not listed on all upcoming listing of ICOs from all popular websites such as coingecko…etc. How did you know Unuversa started preico on 28 aug?

gristinvest5
Irregular
49
Almost all ICO’s make you say you are not a US citizen. It’s precautionary for them to do so. And are you saying bancor not banker? They teamed up with kickico which was already a legit crypto so I would assume it’s good at least now with the combining of the two. Whether people like crypto’s or not doesn’t matter or whether they think it’s great or not what matters is they are here their not going anywhere and everyone wishes they had bought some bitcoin or eth when it was nothing and for 1 grand spent would now be… Read more »
PNGento
Guest
0
PNGento

Not sure if “almost all” is accurate, but yes, “many” do. Universa doesn’t. My money is still on Universa: https://check.universa.io/-abJt63. It is in pre-ICO status right now, so there are days left to more fully vet this ICO, but I still believe it is the one Agora is hyping. I will be standing by until the ICO date arrives…and in the meantime, getting some free UTNs. Click the link above and you TOO can get some free UTNs. Just sayin’

dezster32
Irregular
-1
dezster32
Thank you all for your comments so far…been following – am new to all this….So that I understand what I think I am reading here, a pre-ICO purchase of either Universa or Chronolog for that matter is around $22000USD !? Is that right ? And then 2nd, what is going to happen to your $ if you purchased a pre-ICO and then it ICO’s ? I am kinda lost re: the difference between the 2 or why pre-ICO ( other than I imagine you’re getting in cheaper) but I am a bit fuzzy here and what happens if you do… Read more »
Marco Polo
Irregular
30
Marco Polo
Cryptocurrencies are just that, currencies, not investments. The “price” of a bitcoin in USD’s is a cross rate, like any other currency. As a currency, how liquid is the market? If the cross rate today is 4,000:1 in USD’s, and I have 1,000 bitcoins, can I “trade” them for the dead presidents? Who’s going to give me that many dead presidents; even digital ones in my bank account? How many merchants will accept bitcoins or any crypto currency for real goods and services? Are you going to be paid in any one of the cryptocurrencies? I know a few, but… Read more »
gristinvest5
Irregular
49

They will treat it as an investment though was what I was getting at and there is no way around that but I think any profits from cryptos should be re invested into companies like cleanteq for example, etc.

gristinvest5
Irregular
49

I wonder how long US citizens will be able to use vpn’s to invest before all crowdfunds use kyc(know your customer) criteria not even allowing the use of a vpn to even try to do so. Many of these if you’re in the US will only be able to be bought on exchanges but I wonder if sooner or later you can’t even do that?

alwayslooking
Irregular
40
alwayslooking

Cryptocurrencies 101: A store of value, fast low cost transactions, and greater privacy and security than fiat currencies. Has anyone tried to spend a 1 oz gold coin or kilo of gold recently? In everyday life, gold is not used as money, but with the new VISA debit cards which are connected to cryptocurrencies, you can actually “spend” your cryptocurrencies today.

DannyC
Guest
0
DannyC

Gold is real money but a collateral for real money. The actual exchange medium between countries shall be SDR. Take a look at all available currency conversion tools on the internet. Cryptos created by private entities should be look upon as a scam as no government around the world would let it take off.

DannyC
Guest
0
DannyC

Gold is not real money but a collateral for real money. The actual exchange medium between countries shall be SDR. Take a look at all available currency conversion tools on the internet. Cryptos created by private entities should be look upon as a scam as no government around the world would let it take off.

alwayslooking
Irregular
40
alwayslooking

Visit coindesk.com for your news updates. Bitcoin is already legal currency in Japan, South Korea, and Australia.

DannyC
Guest
0
DannyC
Dont anyone realised something fishy about these cryptos? Why they forbid US citizens from investing? I believed this is a plot to lure funds into the market just to be rendered invalid at the end. SEC already started to probe cryptos. Just be sensible, do you really believed that any government would actually allow such systems to take off while governments around the world sits back without any actions. Governments required taxation revenues to operate. Imagine everyone using cryptos to evade governments which in actual fact trying to evade taxs too. Can any country be in existence if the government… Read more »
Mark
Guest
0
Wonder if the snake salesman pumping this new bitcoin alternative will take it for his overpriced news letter? With so many crypto currencies popping up, who know which will survive, never mind thrive. I am still shocked over rise of my bitcoins, so can this be duplicated? Who knows, this deal is giving you a $50. bonus just to register prior to funding next month. freeblockchain.ccbmlm.com Guess it all comes down to one fact, you have to be in it to win it. lol Hopefully someone figures out which new crypto currency this one being hyped up is, Thanks for… Read more »
David Schrader
Guest
0
David Schrader

The latest message from the folks at Agora:

Agora Financial editor Louis Basenese (and his team of computer experts) have just effectively “hacked” the “Bitcoin Code”…

This is critical information for anyone looking to make a quick fortune from the red-hot digital currency markets!

Click here to discover how they did it… and how you can potentially turn a tiny grubstake into windfall profits.

I have the grubstake but not the 3k to learn how they “hacked” the Bitcoin Code”…

vivian
Guest
0

oh rats! que chatice! all those years studying Portuguese and I found this Chrono-Logic offering from Agora in Brazil a day too late.

goldstockbull
Irregular
57

DAY tokens are Chrono Logic. I have it rated as one of the worst ICOs to invest in currently. But this market is insane, with everyone throwing money at an ICO. “Proof of Time” is not a major innovation and makes little sense given that all transactions are already timestamped. They do not have an MVP that I can find. The founder’s last project was a caffeine spray to “give you energy.”

Here is my ICO tracker, free at the moment: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1oNWInqMuP0Qb8aTLkx0JbZHUCJgyWyiVAW44m13c9JY/edit?usp=sharing

manhattanmadman
Guest
0
manhattanmadman

Really cool report. Which are you putting your own money behind?

Have you seen the MLM one? What do you think of this: http:cryptocoinsfree.ccbmlm.com

There is a $50 free sign up bonus and more bonus for referrals.

PNGento
Guest
0
PNGento

Just signed up, but NO free $50 sign up bonus…so, just pointing out that this is false.

Random
Irregular
13

Goldstockbull you should charge $3000 😉

sundog88
Member
4
sundog88

Goldstockbull – Thank you for sharing.

Crypto Newb
Guest
0
Crypto Newb

but what about the new BTC stock, symbol BTSC?

patrick
Guest
0
patrick

thanks a lot for that link. some interesting ones there. picked up a small stake in modum. i’m not too technical but i think their biz model could work

aqrobles
Guest
0
aqrobles
The funny thing is that by searching for Agora’s hyped mystery crypto, we have turned up some pretty good investment candidates and educated ourselves more about this emerging market – and it didn’t cost us $3000! I’m now positive Universa is NOT the crypto that Agora was hyping, but we all stumbled across this gem while looking for it. I don’t have the Bitcoin to participate in the pre-ICO, so I’ll wait for the ICO. As Shatner used to say, “its going to be big!”. If you want the link to pre-ICO and get 50 free mUTN tokens ( =… Read more »
prorsum
Irregular
7

Why is this any different the “Hayek” coin by Anthem Gold?

Crypto Newb
Guest
0
Crypto Newb

Off topic, but what about the new BTC stock, symbol BTSC?

Andre
Irregular
10

it’s some pennystock .. try GBTC instead !

Wfp
Guest
0
Wfp

GBTC is doing well.

WFP
Guest
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WFP

GBTC just dropped 20% from 1005 to 800 when declared overvalued.

WFP
Guest
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WFP

I sold it @ 1005. Will wait to see what happens next.

Crypto Newb
Guest
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Crypto Newb

Does GBTC mirror Bitcoin movement?

socr
Irregular
3
socr

one tenth of btc but with a huge premium ,about 40% above the actual btc price,wich is insane

Robbie
Guest
0
Robbie

After many hours of research, I am sure this is the best (and only at this stage) Bitcoin and Euthereum tracker: https://xbtprovider.com/ Check here: http://www.nasdaqomxnordic.com/etp/etn/etninfo?Instrument=SSE109538
You can trade both cryptos in SEK or Euro.
I my humble opinion, if the Nordic Nasdaq are willing to list these 2 cryptos, then there must be some sort of value to it – but only to that 2.
Also interesting: https://coinmarketcap.com/

wizard17861
Irregular
13

FYI
One Gram is NOT available to buy in the USA Blacklisted because of “usa security and exchange requirements” Tried to buy could not.

Crypto Newb
Guest
0
Crypto Newb

How in the world do you guys follow this thread with replies scrambled all over the place? never seen anything like this!

Boxter
Guest
0
Boxter
Did anybody of you really analyzed the Universa Blockchain ? In my opinion you can describe Universa Blockchain as a modification of the Ripple network technology applied to smart contracts according to the Open Smart Contract standard. Just read the whitepaper in detail. A cryptocurrency is not really part of this blockchain. It can be generated using the blockchain. Main goal of the Universa Blockchain is boosting the smart contract business including also purchase contracts with any kind of currency, fiat or crypto. Transaction speed is similar to the Ripple network or XRP transactions and not really revolutionary because the… Read more »
Thousand
Guest
0
Thousand

Hey, there is a Telegram group with the CEO from Universa, please check:

https://t.me/Uplatform

You can sign in to their page and get a credit of 50mUTN (they are selling each UTN for 10usd. 1 UTN = 1000mUTN), so this sign in credit would potentialy be worth 5usd, here is the link:

https://check.universa.io/-e4Gqez

I am in the telegram group and already talked privatle with the CEO, Mr. Bodovich, nice guy. Project has lot of portential, still unknow out of Russia.

alwayslooking
Irregular
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alwayslooking

I agree with your analysis, and that is why I do not intend to invest in the ICO.

Biosmg
Guest
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Biosmg

I think that universa is the one to they have link you can go to get free token just by signing https://check.universa.io/-cLSG2r

roland1966
Irregular
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roland1966

In his teaser was Hutchinson speaking about an altcoin with the power to give to cryptoworld great benefits, a tool for everyday use,( worldwide acceptation ) and even replace the dollar in time, that can only be an prize stable coin, like the CORIAN coin, otherwise there,s only trading with coins left.

roland1966
Irregular
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roland1966

Must be CORION.

Brad
Guest
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Brad

I really thought this was AI Coin.
In the teaser they mentioned UnCapped Profits, nothing about the coin itself being uncapped. AI Coin’s ICO Ended August 28th, so that matches up too. I read their whitepaper, it’s a very intriguing idea; they use AI to trade the top cryptos 24/7; which would mean if their algorithms and models are successful, this thing could be huge from compounding profits over time.

Andre
Irregular
10

I thought so too and got 5 ETH worth of them .. will see what happens

steelgtr
Member
0
steelgtr

How did you participate? What is the symbol?

Andre
Irregular
10

XAI – aicoin.io – you’d need to have some ETH first (got them at coinbase.com

steelgtr
Member
0
steelgtr

What exchange did you use to buy XAI? thx

nobodyisperfect1@aol.com
Irregular
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nobodyisperfect1@aol.com
It’s not on a large crypto exchange yet. It will be listed for sale on their own website. https://www.firstglobalcredit.com/ I think you can still setup an account at http://www.aicoin.io but crypto you deposit in their dashboard gives you an opportunity to buy the coins at market price only. The ICO was finalized with a cap of around 77,000,000 XAI. They raised just under $3,000,000 USD. The first week of trading for Wintermute (that’s their name for the AI) went really well considering it was an overall down market. Here are the official results… https://www.aicoin.io/2017/09/11/official-valuation-week-ending-8th-sep-2017/ It made 4% in only one… Read more »
vivian lewis
Guest
0
the best thing about alternative currencies like Bitcoin is not the coins but the blockchain which will soon make it easier and quicker to send money from one country to another, on condition that both have respectable central banks and regulators. More and more serious banks are signing up for the tech (by a UK firm which is not publicly quoted, alas). As a global investing person in my private as well as my professional life I desperately need banks to overcome the horrors of Swift, the existing system founded in Balgium by JP Morgan 50 or so years ago.… Read more »
patrick
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patrick

while i agree swift is slow and expensive, my 50+ transactions over the years have all been smooth except for one, and it was partially my fault.

Felipe
Guest
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Felipe

Vivian do you have telegram? Or whatsapp?

Angelo Restrepo
Guest
0
Angelo Restrepo

A friend of mine are buying a membership from Banyan Hill that is releasing the name of the new coin on September 5th. If anyone wants to split the costs with us, let us know. If you facebook me i have a tanktop on and I am driving a car.

gristinvest5
Irregular
49

Are you talking about teeka’s newsletter? If you are doing that one I’m in. I have went by last month’s sample that I found online and the man was spot on. Everything.

Bob Snelgrove
Guest
0
Bob Snelgrove

Are you talking about the $3000 letter? I’m kicking myself for missing that at 2K, now closed. I subbed to the baby version but would go in with anyone that wants to split it. If so, how do we do private messages here?

thx

Bob Snelgrove
Guest
0
Bob Snelgrove

Grist, can you link the sample newsletter? thx

gristinvest5
Irregular
49

Bob, I will pm it to you, but I think you have to sign up as an irregular to do pm’s. But yes I would also be interested in going in with others to get the newsletter. Travis is it okay to post it on the regular forum since I found August’s newsletter online?

steelgtr
Member
0
steelgtr

I just signed up so hopefully I can PM now. Exactly what newsletter are you referring to? thx.

steelgtr
Member
0
steelgtr

Can you message me on facebook? I’m the one with a cowboy hat sitting at a steel guitar? (Bob Snelgrove)

https://www.facebook.com/bob.snelgrove.7

bosslion
Member
1
bosslion

Teeka is having another webinar tonight 7 pm CT. I’m also interested in going in with others to get the newsletter. I don’t know how to private message you guys. If interested, let me know – time sensitive!

gristinvest5
Irregular
49

The newsletter I was referring to is Teeka’s crypto newsletter

steelgtr
Member
0
steelgtr

He is talking about Extreme Fortunes:
https://banyanhill.com/extreme-fortunes/

Michel1962
Guest
0
Michel1962

Any soughts about Bankera? There is a pre-ICO starting August 28 which fits Hutchinson’s paper and it seems that Bankera will provide a complete banking service.

gristinvest5
Irregular
49

I do know that Bankera teamed up with kickico which I would think would be beneficial to both but I am pretty sure the August 28 ICO was chronologic. If you look at other teasers it stated that the 28th ico had a former goldman sach’s guy on board and it was based on time.

gristinvest5
Irregular
49

Palm Beach confidential Teeka’s Crypto’s

jumboh
Irregular
101
jumboh

Wondering what people think about cryptocurrency now that China and South Korea have blocked participation in ICOs

manhattanmadman
Irregular
57
manhattanmadman

Be careful out there. Check out this story on ICO’s being investigated by China.

https://www.ethnews.com/chinese-government-reveals-list-of-60-icos-under-investigation

manhattanmadman
Irregular
57
manhattanmadman
I found this site where you can earn free crypto coins for doing surveys and watching ads. The payouts are small, but they offer lots of coins. Pick a coin that goes up and earnings can multiply. Civic is one of the coins I have high hopes for in the long-term, but to be safe, my overall goal in cryptos is to have as diverse a portfolio as possible. What I do is go to Earn Civic at the top left, and then Watch Videos. Load up 3 of the Engage Me videos in separate windows and let them all… Read more »
orokusaki
Member
8
orokusaki

Good read, covers ICOs, risks associated with cryptocurrencies, forms of attacks and government oversight well – https://gumroad.com/l/uCzRz/cr

manhattanmadman
Irregular
57
manhattanmadman

If anyone wanted to get in on the Ahoolee ICO it’s on now and they are offering a 5% referral bonus for both of us. Let me know here if you want the info.

More info on the ICO here: http://ahoolee.io/en/

manhattanmadman
Guest
0

If anyone is interested in the Blackmoon ICO it’s going on now and there is a referral link. https://account.blackmooncrypto.com/?ref=D4A419

Here are a few reviews of this ICO (thanks Jim)

Blackmoon Crypto ICO Review – The Next OMG (OmiseGo)? Why I like the fundamentals of this ICO
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAKQBr1u9e8

Blackmoon Crypto (BMC) – investment funds using blockchain technology – quick ICO review (update)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pw0wWicyTuk

orokusaki
Member
8
orokusaki

An Investor Lesson In Shit Coins – If you’re messing around with 20 different coins, and waiting for every single ICO to strike it rich, you’re probably playing with fire. You can read the article here – https://www.coinstrategy.io/single-post/2017/09/11/Don%E2%80%99t-Buy-FARM-or-FarmTownLife-Token-An-Investor-Lesson-In-Shit-Coins

manhattanmadman
Irregular
57
manhattanmadman

Here is another ICO on pre sale that I a putting a small amount into. Any thoughts?

WCX Global Low-Cost Digital Currency Exchange

Note, they are giving 50 free coins for sign up and 15% bonus coins if you invest for both of us so please use the first link.
https://wcex.co/?ref=h68bTG6

This is their whitepaper:
https://ico.wcex.co/whitepaper?lang=en

Pre sale now, ICO in October.

For the record, I have invested in ICO/Pre Sale on uTrust, Aholee, Blackmoon and now WCX.

rjbarnett
Member
1
rjbarnett

in my book, the key to crypto-trading is finding a company , not a coin, with deep pockets and proven market performance. the USI-tech crypto outfit is a proven Forex software bot trader. see details at https://rjbarnett.usi-tech.info

pozoblue
Irregular
22

To those of you who invested in AI, I am curious about past week’s performance.

Didi
Guest
0
Didi

Did anyone ever definitively figure this out? Or was the Aug 28 date just all smoke and mirrors to incite newsletter sales?

Ayo Popoola
Guest
0
Ayo Popoola

Bankera a blockchain bank

modo
Guest
0
modo
Have subscribed on this service subscription for almost 2 months now and have followed their recommendations. Now am losing money with almost all of their recommended cryptos and they are down in price. Below is a partial summary of their recommend portfolio with corresponding gains: Name Gain OmiseGO -39% Golem -31% Monero 76% Komodo 65% Edgeless -38% Waves -12% Blocknet -8% The results clearly don’t meet up with their claims of giving over triple digit gains. And even up to now there is still no update on their ICO coin Chronologic. I don’t recommend anyone subscribing on this service as… Read more »
93vette
Member
3
93vette

Buyer beware…everyone is trying to push a crypto newsletter now. I just saw a Webinar with James (“Choose Yourself” ) Altucher. He was pushing something called his Crypto Secret Newletter….oh yeah, for the paltry sum of $4,000 you’re in the club! James is clearly following his own advice and choosing himself.
I will be learning the hard way on this as I guessed it would be the Solomon Exchange…what a joke…they raised the enormous sum of 163k….I don’t expect I’ll see that investment again… All I can say is proceed with caution.

alwayslooking
Irregular
40
alwayslooking

Except for Edgeless and Blocknet, the other recommendations are generally well regarded. How Chronologic provides value to anyone remains a mystery to me. They did not even buy it during the ICO, which was not available to US residents, but they are waiting for the coin to hit the public exchanges. You might have done as well watching YouTube videos for recommendations.

Dezster32
Guest
0
Dezster32

Thank you for sharing and the warning but couldn’t follow which newsletters /author are you subscribing to ?

manhattanmadman
Irregular
57
manhattanmadman

The Cartaxi.io is ending soon. This is a really interesting ICO with an established business in place. They are using the funds to expand to new markets. They also pay out 25% of the profit to the coin holders and have already made payments.

Use my link if you want to sign up: https://cartaxi.io/invite/b555095403d4d10e

bburn3rd
Irregular
2

I’d just like to know who is the most reliable experts and advisors regarding the crypto-currency industry. Especially ones that don’t want nonrefundable $2,000 plus fees for their newsletters. Anybody got any suggestions ??!!!

alwayslooking
Irregular
40
alwayslooking

Palm Beach Confidential and Altucher Report. PBC is offering a free webinar on Nov 2. They will probably offer a discount on their annual subscription after the webinar. Altucher Report is only $49/year–best deal for newbies. The Dollar Vigilante offers acrid commentary and analysis which is worth the relatively modest subscription price.

ntxbulldog
Irregular
2
ntxbulldog
Palm Beach Confidential and Teeka Tiwari had their very overly hyped hour and a half webinar tonight. I do believe in the crypto movement, and he is long Bitcoin, touted a free coin XRP Ripple as one he likes under $1.00, but then left the “Chinese/Portuguese” connected coin off the pitch. So we can sign up for a 2 year for $2500 by midnight today. I want to join a mining pool, but they don’t allow US citizens. But I guess if I invest and use a VPN in Canada, wonder how they know? BTC crossing $7315 now, are you… Read more »
alwayslooking
Irregular
40
alwayslooking

I listened to the webinar. My guess is that the privacy coin he touted but did not reveal is Komodo (KMD) which is around $2.40 now. I bought some in early September. Also the UTRUST ICO hit their soft cap of $10 million in 24 hours. They have a good team, but a lot of work to do to get a functional product on the market. I got in on the pre-ICO, which sold out in a few hours. I am surprised their ICO did not do better. Maybe ICO-fatigue is setting in.

Stephen Stuart
Guest
0
Stephen Stuart

I listened as well. Not sure if I want to spend $2500. for service. Good call! How do you buy Komodo? I have Bitcoin acct. on Coinbase.

alwayslooking
Irregular
40
alwayslooking

You can buy Komodo (KMD) at bittrex.com. Zcoin (XZC) and Quantum Resistant Ledger (QRL) also have good long term prospects as privacy coins.

sstuartmd
Irregular
8

TRAVIS:
What do you think about have a regular thread on cryptos, as they seem to be expanding quite rapidly?

manhattanmadman
Irregular
57
manhattanmadman

I would be interested in ongoing crypto coverage and discussion.

alwayslooking
Irregular
40
alwayslooking

Hi, Travis. Good idea to have a new thread on cryptos. Can you start one?

isinc13
Irregular
2
isinc13
I listened in on the Nov 2nd briefing by Teeka Tiwari, though I never did hear the new crypto he was recommending. I understand that if you signed up by the Friday night deadline (special fee of $2500 for 2 years) you would get the name of this crypto. It would be good to get the names of some of their current recs just to see if it’s more hype than anything. The big tease on this special event was the giveaway of $1 million in bitcoin. I am in the learning phase with all this so would welcome any… Read more »
alwayslooking
Irregular
40
alwayslooking
Teeka recommended Ripple (XRP) during the webinar. He teased a privacy coin, which I suspect might be Komodo (KMD). He has been on a hot streak the past three months, with triple digit gains on GAS and XLM. But no analyst stays hot continuously, so his next few recommendations just might go nowhere. His newsletter is meant for newbies. If you have time to do your own research, you will recognize all of the coins in his recommended portfolio. They have all been mentioned by other newsletter writers and by the YouTube cryptocoin analysts. I am not a subscriber to… Read more »
Isinc13
Guest
0
Isinc13

Appreciate the helpful comments. I am definitely interested in hearing more in a crypto thread.

alwayslooking
Irregular
40
alwayslooking

Several YouTube videos reconfirmed that the privacy coin recently promoted by Palm Beach Confidential was ZENCASH (not KMD or PIVX or VERGE or SYS). It went up 300% in a week, so their subscribers had another home run.

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