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What’s that “August 28 ICO” pitch from Martin Hutchinson about?

Checking out the introductory "will be bigger than bitcoin and ethereum" ad for Crypto Alert from Agora Financial

By Travis Johnson, Stock Gumshoe, August 15, 2017

“An entirely new digital currency will hit the net on August 28

“It will rapidly replace ALL current “crypto-currencies”… and then ring the funeral bell for the mighty U.S. dollar

“Profits on this new currency are completely uncapped (unlike Bitcoin)… and based on past modeling, I predict they’ll be 1,000 times higher than we’ve ever seen before

“Making this your ONE LAST chance to get in on the ground floor of the hottest market trend in more than 2,300 years… RIGHT NOW”

That’s the attention-getting promise from Martin Hutchinson’s pitch for his new Crypto Alert service with Louis Basenese, which is a fairly pricey ($3,000 one time fee, $199/yr maintenance fee) newsletter published by Agora Financial.

And I’ll warn you up front, I don’t know for sure which coin it is that Hutchinson is hinting at — though I’ll share a low-conviction guess with you after we roll through the clues.

The time is ripe for these kinds of pitches, of course, because we’ve seen cryptocurrencies skyrocket over the past year, even big ones like bitcoin and ethereum, and we’ve also gone from fewer than 100 cryptocurrencies a year ago to more than 1,000 now, with dozens more being launched each month as new developers try to get in on the frenzy or add something to the blockchain/altcurrency/cryptocurrency marketplace.

Hutchinson also claims credit as an expert on cryptocurrencies, partly as a result of the article he coauthored for the Cato Journal a couple years ago. He says that he “won’t bore you with all the technical details” of that article, perhaps partly because the article was entitled “Bitcoin Will Bite the Dust,” but I thought it was worth reading (and he has backtracked some from that assertion of late).

That article did wisely point out one of the problems of Bitcoin, the reliance on that network of miners to validate Bitcoin transactions, and the extent to which economies of scale (and an arms race in computing power) would pressure the system:

“Despite its success, the Bitcoin system is unsustainable due to a design flaw at the very heart of the system. The problem is that Bitcoin requires competition on the part of “bitcoin miners” who validate transactions blocks, but this competition is unsustainable in the long run because of economies of scale in the mining industry. Indeed, these economies of scale are so large that the bitcoin mining industry is a natural monopoly. Furthermore, there are signs that competition in this industry is already breaking down. Once that happens, the system will no longer be able to function as it hitherto has. Its key attractions (decentralization, absence of a single point of failure, and anonymity) will disappear; there will no longer be any reason for users to stay with it; and the system will collapse.”

And there’s some interesting info in the conclusions as well, here’s part of the sum-up about bitcoin:

“Even in the unlikely event that it survives into the medium run, we would still rate its longer-term chance of survival as zero. First, we should remember that a recurring theme in the history of innovation is that the pioneers rarely, if ever, survive. This is because early models are always flawed and later entrants are able to learn from the mistakes of their predecessors. There is no reason why Bitcoin should be an exception to this historical rule. The second reason is that in the very long run bitcoin would be uncompetitive against efficient closed-wall systems such as PayPal or COEPTIS, the successor to e-gold. Once the production of bitcoins becomes insignificant, then the Bitcoin system will entirely depend on transaction fees to cover its operational costs, and its fee levels would be higher than those of more traditional payment systems because of the need to maintain excess hashing and excess capacity to deter new entrants into the transaction validation business. Put differently, Bitcoin can never achieve the technical economic efficiency of competitors that can operate with a very small number of servers, or even just one. In the very long term, when there are no new bitcoins being produced to subsidize the validation process, the Bitcoin system will no longer be able to compete.20 Last but not least, there is still the problem that Bitcoin is not backed by anything.”

That doesn’t mean anything about the near-term value of an asset that is traded based almost entirely on sentiment and momentum, of course, and it doesn’t really give great insight into the immediate prognosis for any of the other cryptocurrencies — bitcoin was trading between $200-$250 at the time that article was published, during the doldrums following the first real run in bitcoin prices in the years previous (and many of the first wave of “me too” cryptocurrencies had already lost 99% of their value), and it recovered sharply over the following year and, as we now know, went almost parabolic in 2017 as the bitcoin price surged from $1,000 to $4,000.

Let’s get back to the ad…

“When you see teenage hackers with backward baseball caps start getting clued into the same exact tipping point as gray-beard economists with silk ties… and Silicon Valley venture capitalists… and Wall Street investment bankers…

“Even ordinary Americans like Jared Kenna (a beer brewer who made more than $30 million trading Bitcoin). Or Charlie Noble (who revealed to CNBC that a fellow Ethereum trader made a 300,000% gain in less than a minute).

“That’s when know that something must be about to happen.”

That scares the heck out of me, mostly because it’s the same thing that drove sentiment during the internet bubble in 1999 — and, frankly, that drives most bubbles: “We’re all making money because we’re all making money!” When a cab driver gives you stock tips about the next internet sensation in 1999, that’s scary… when the waitress talks up the twelve houses she bought with no money down in 2005, that’s frightening… and when the high school kid who mows your lawn tries to convince you to buy the latest initial coin offering for a new cryptocurrency in 2017, I can’t help but feel that same twinge of fear.

Sometimes, as we know, the “something” that “must be about to happen” is a big old slap in the face as reality hits all at once.

Reality might not hit, of course, or it it might not hit anytime soon, I don’t know — many of the pundits persist in predicting that the next debt ceiling showdown will drive the prices of cryptocurrencies higher, as arguably happened during the first bitcoin surge a few years back, but that’s clutching at a rational reason for things that have already increased by thousands of percent, in some cases, for no real reason. Maybe it will happen — the cryptocurrencies do tend to react to crises like gold does, at least recently (as in, they rose during North Korea fear last week, and fell during the return of North Korea complacency this week), so you can place your bets where you like regarding the next possible dollar crisis this Fall (or whatever the next crisis du jour might be).

What Hutchinson seems excited about here is the potential for this alt-currency market to become a “winner take all” arena… where, naturally, he’ll have chosen the winner:

“You’re talking about a toll-booth for every single transaction that happens, every single second, all around the world. And it’s all no sweat, because there are NO physical barriers whatsoever to one currency dominating ALL of it. And FAST….

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“… the whole point of a currency is that it becomes the standard that all other transactions are measured by.

“Again, winner takes all.

“That’s why your grandchildren won’t use ‘dollars’ to describe a big score.

“No, they’ll use the name of the coin being issued in this historic ICO…

“How do you make the best investment opportunity of the 21st century 1,000 times better? Just add a few more zeroes…”

The big pitch is that bitcoin and ethereum have been huge winners, but that this next coin offering will supplant both of those and the US dollar and become a ridiculous profit-maker… more from Hutchinson:

“… what’s even more amazing here…

“Is that there are still so many more zeroes on the table, by getting in on this next big ICO.

“Remember, if I’m correct that this ultimate digital currency will replace not only Bitcoin and Ethereum, but also the U.S. dollar itself.”

He even includes a chart that indicates the total potential for this initial coin offering is the “total value of all physical currencies” … so we can’t fault him for a lack of ambition.

And, yes, he does include the stipulation that this probably won’t happen:

“So let’s be real – turning a few hundred bucks today into the sum of all the money in the world is not going to happen for you. You are not going to literally make a trillion dollars from this ICO trade.

“Obviously you’ll need to set your sights lower than that.

“All I’m trying to demonstrate is how BIG this revolution in the world’s currency use could become… because this theoretically could all happen over the long run.”

The big sum-up:

“Because in the long run, only ONE NEW CURRENCY will become the STANDARD. (Just like the dollar did in the 20th century.)

“My research convinces me it will be THIS one. And the thing is, when I say ‘long run’ here, I don’t mean a century.

“I’m talking months, or even weeks.

“I know, that’s extremely unlikely.

“But we’re talking about history here. And the one lesson we’ve learned from history, across thousands of years, is that things do not stay the same. And when they do change – it always happens much, much faster than conventional wisdom says it should.”

So what is the actual ICO that Hutchinson is talking about here? I can’t claim to be much of an expert on the intricacies of all the different cryptocurrencies (though I do own small chunks of bitcoin, ethereum and litecoin), but let’s see if he drops enough clues for us to throw some guesses on the table for you:

“In an uncapped ICO, the early investors buy as much as they want. And then in the weeks, months, and years after the ICO, further production of the coin is sensibly limited to avoid inflation.

“Which means if the coin is in high demand, its price will then go through the roof!

“That’s why I’ve been searching carefully over these past few years for an ICO with totally uncapped profits….”

OK, I guess that makes some sense. You want the ICO price to be low enough and the future coin generation to be low enough that you stand a better chance of making money. That’s just logic, though, and there isn’t any one rule about how you price an ICO (since, for most cryptocurrencies, there’s no “there” there — there’s nothing on which to base a valuation).

“Since Bitcoin hit the scene in 2009, digital currencies have been something like a Catch-22 for investors:

“The MORE reliable coins tended to have capped profits

“And the LESS reliable coins tended to have uncapped profits

“There just wasn’t a great choice for traders.

“Until now.

“… that all ends on August 28, when this new uncapped ICO takes off.

“Why I’m staking my entire career on this ONE digital coin… predicting that it will RAPIDLY replace both Bitcoin and the U.S. Dollar… and digging into my own wallet to make this effectively FREE for the first 199 readers who take me up on it today….

“I’m putting all of my chips down on ONE new coin, and declaring it the swift & final WINNER of the digital currency wars.”

OK, so that’s certainly a bold statement. Which is what you have to make if you’re trying to get someone to pony up $3,000 when they don’t know you from Adam. Any other clues?

“I don’t want to bore you with the specifics, but the way this entirely new kind of currency works is that it puts a tiny fragment of code on millions of computers all around the world.

“And each of those computers has a different fragment of the code.

“Put them all together, and the amount of computer muscle devoted to securing this system equates to more electric power than the entire states of Nebraska, Delaware, and New Hampshire use.

“More than 19.23 terawatt-hours in total.”

OK, as a non-expert that pretty much sounds like most of the other clues in the ad — like it could apply to almost any cryptocurrency, all of which (as far as I’ve seen) rely to some degree on a distributed network of computers verifying transactions and monitoring the security of the blockchain. That is, after all, the point of the blockchain, that you have a distributed system where security rests on so many people’s shoulders that it’s almost guaranteed.

More from Hutchinson:

“The strongest mathematical models in the world imply that it would be impossible for this new type of security algorithm to be broken.

“This makes the new digital currency in this Aug. 28 ICO more stable than the dollars in your pocket – where we’re one Janet Yellen ‘taper’ or Donald Trump ‘tweet’ away from total mayhem.”

And one more clue:

“… the technology behind this new ICO even allows for the creation of ‘smart contracts,’ so that free people can make business deals without any lawyers, or brokers, or bankers, or regulators involved whatsoever.”

That was a big part of the selling point of ethereum, that it was effectively more of a programming language than just a transactional blockchain-controlled currency and could incorporate smart contracts and all kinds of other useful tools… and lots of other coins or tokens or cryptocurrencies or whatever you want to call them offer this kind of function as well.

So does that get us any closer to our answer? Not really. The clues are all generic and could apply to pretty much any cryptocurrency, particularly since so many of the new ICOs are based on ethereum and have that blockchain’s access to smart contracts… and the limitation of time could be pointing to one of the dozen or so ICOs that have been announced or are underway as of the end of August, or to the need to inspire immediate action for possible newsletter subscribers in an artificial deadline, or a coin offering that is underway and might end as early as August 28 if there’s a lot of demand.

There are dozens of possible ICOs that could match these clues that are now open or will be open soon, you can browse them at places like ICO Alert or TokenMarket or CoinSchedule, though there are plenty of others that have slightly different data.

And I don’t see any sign of one that stands out in those lists, frankly. So… I’ll throw out a guess based on what I’ve read of Martin Hutchinson’s work over the years… my guess is that he’s pitching what he has often talked about wanting: a secure, possibly anonymous cryptocurrency that’s backed by gold, and there is one such service that’s currently in the “ICO” phase and has a fixed token price so won’t inflate away the gains with ICO overbidding, (though they don’t use the term ICO): OneGram.

OneGram could easily not be the one he’s actually recommending, of course, this is very much a guess — and this one is a bit atypical in the cryptocurrency world, partly because it has its own blockchain instead of being built on bitcoin or ethereum’s blockchain (most new coins are based on ethereum), but they do say that their blockchain is based on successful parts of bitcoin and other systems.

OneGram is essentially a way to buy expensive gold and get an uncertain cryptocurrency for your trouble — they indicate that each coin is backed by a gram of gold, and that you buy the coin with gold (using their own brokerage only, GoldGuard, and after adding a premium/fee of something like 10%). They say that they will finish the token sales when they hit their limit or in about 38 days, but at this point they’ve sold about 2/3 of the available tokens so they may well hit the limit around August 28, I have no idea.

I also don’t know anything about GoldGuard, or what other fees they might charge. The appeal here, as I understand it, is that they will try to turn this into a real cryptocurrency that is used for transactions, and that the transaction fee they charge (2% or so, presumably) will be rolled back into the asset base, adding marginally more gold to the value of each OneGram token over time. Assuming, of course, that there are a meaningful number of transactions.

And the promise, which is appealing, is that the downside is limited because of that gold backing — since they actually have the gold in a vault somewhere, the coins are not likely to trade for a lot less than the value of the gold they represent… so perhaps if gold goes up in value and a gram is worth twice as much in a year as it is today, your token will rise in value as well.

I can see the appeal of that, but I have no idea how the market will take it. The only real point in trading in these wild west cryptocurrencies, unless you want to make it your life’s work to really become an expert on all the underlying technology and pick winners and losers (I’m not qualified for that, perhaps you are), is that they might surge by 1,000% and reward you amply for the risk you’re taking… so will this seemingly lower-risk gold-backed currency end up rising less because the price of gold acts more as an anchor than a foundation… or will crazy cryptocoin traders bid it up regardless of the underlying gold value? You’d need a couple PhD’s in psychology to predict how it will play out, I expect, and even then you’re guessing.

OneGram is also, by the way, a project based in the Middle East and backed by some big investors there, with the focus of their launch as a transactional currency likely to be the various Gulf emirates… and the currency is designed to be Sharia compliant as a gold-backed investment, though I don’t really know whether all Muslim cryptocurrency investors are likely to draw the line at the same place OneGram has. I don’t know if that will make a difference or not in their effort to launch and gain some traction. OneGram’s website is here, should you wish to research it further, and it includes a typical (though quite short and detail-light) “whitepaper” descriptive commentary as well as a link to token sales, which go through Gold Guard.

So… that’s all the guesses I have for you on that front, I don’t see an obvious candidate for an ICO that’s currently being offered that has the potential to unseat bitcoin or ethereum, which are the established brands, (and the currencies by which many of those new currencies are valued), but I’m also pretty skeptical about the whole idea… I love the idea of the blockchain, it has the potential to be as powerful as the world wide web or email in terms of transformative technologies for the Internet, but I don’t see a way in which any current cryptocurrency holders really “own” that technology in a meaningful way, and it’s really a wild west R&D project — the only real world business that’s important in the world of cryptocurrencies right now is the business of creating and selling new cryptocurrencies.

Cryptocurrencies matter, and maybe they’ll be part of the solution of our constantly depreciating national currencies or the inflation explosions that destroy economies from time to time, but that doesn’t mean I can come up with a reasonable logical answer to the question “what should bitcoin (or ethereum, or any of the others) be worth today?”

And if I can’t at least guess at an answer to that question using a sharpie and a bar napkin, I’ve got no business putting much money at risk in it. Perhaps if you trust the OneGram folks and wade through the fees and think it will be worthwhile there’s some “value” underlying that token thanks the gold backing, but, well, on that front I’m just as happy owning an actual gold coin. I’ve held some cryptocurrencies for a few years, in relatively small amounts even after they’ve surged by 1,000% or so (they would make up about 3% of my equity portfolio if they were stocks), so I don’t think they’re pointless and I do think they’re worth following… I just can’t get past the fact that I can’t put a reasonable price on them, so that keeps me from getting my feet any wetter than they already are. I won’t be buying any OneGram, but perhaps I’ll pick up another gold coin.

Curmudgeonly? Dimwitted? Missing the boat? I’ve had much worse yelled at me across the cyberseas… what do you think about the cryptocurrencies? have a favorite new one that you think other folks should get excited about, or that you think Martin Hutchinson is peddling? Think they’re all junk? Love or hate your bitcoin or ethereum or ripple or steem or whatever? Let us know with a comment below.

P.S. Things have gotten crazy enough with the deluge of ICO’s that the SEC stepped in with a warning letter… and also clarified that these coins are generally classified as securities and shouldn’t be sold willy-nilly without regulation or oversight or licensing (OK, they used different words than that) — you might want to check out their letter here, beyond putting some worthwhile fright into the mind of potential speculators, which is healthy, it also gives a decent overview of the ICO world and explains some of the terms pretty well.

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vivian
August 15, 2017 7:47 pm

it seems to me that if you want gold you should buy gold. am I missing something?
the classy way to buy gold is to find a vintage US gold coin which was held back when FDR called in gold coins in 1933, which had been carefully wrapped up and hidden. I was given a $5 gold coin like that as my something old when I got married and it is in the safe now. You should be wary of foreign coins that have been minted to cut the deficit in countries like France during the whole 20th century, called Napoleons but not dating back that far. Alternatively you can buy a gold bar or a part of a gold bar. Or buy physical gold with bullionvault.com which used to advertise in my newsletter. It is sponsored by the World Gold Council (of gold miners) and is relatively cheap for physical gold purchase, sale, and keeping (you can have it delivered but that costs a lot.)

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Ray Noesges
Member
Ray Noesges
August 15, 2017 7:48 pm

Tried to open an account with Goldguard.
Everything was good until I was told that the United States was BLACKLISTED??

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Jaka Mele
August 16, 2017 6:06 am

Due to US SEC’s old and broad law where anything can be interpreted a security, decentralized startups tend to play it safe and just prohibit us citizens from investing.

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Angela
Irregular
Angela
August 15, 2017 9:48 pm
Reply to  Ray Noesges

Yeah, not on the ICO list either. Sharia and Islamic Finance read the white paper! not sure what you are financing here!

jimbo16
Member
jimbo16
August 16, 2017 10:24 am
Reply to  Ray Noesges

Ray-I have personally reviewed 60-70 of the new ICO’s this summer…every one with the exception of Salt Lending bars investment for US citizens….it just means you buy into them using tokens you own in any wallet or exchange. Just click send to the wallet address for the ICO sale and you bought it. The SEC has pretty strict requirements for any security and most of these ICO’s are vague and nothing more than concepts in development etc….similar to many penny stocks. But just cause you see barred in the US, doesn’t mean you can’t participate.

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James
Guest
James
August 21, 2017 7:03 am
Reply to  jimbo16

And Salt Lending is a joke. Avoid at all costs!

jimbo16
Member
jimbo16
August 21, 2017 8:40 am
Reply to  James

You are new to crypto? What is the joke may i ask?

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jimbo16
Member
jimbo16
August 21, 2017 3:38 pm
Reply to  James

Do your own homework James but this is only many of many sources you should check out
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1MXU-CiDWWywXJQO2KJSvNOmbXOxxRb1BxwjDaEOqnBk/edit

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Hopewell
Hopewell
August 17, 2017 4:37 pm
Reply to  Ray Noesges

Same here – the US Blacklisted – what the hell? I say you’re blacklisted GoldGuard!

jimbo16
Member
jimbo16
August 15, 2017 8:05 pm

Good guess Travis but i just dunno. I did not see in your section of teasers that this was necessarily tied to gold? Just reading most of it sort of sounds like an ICO i have participated in in a small way. It is not your typical crowdfunding but went on sale a month ago and it will last about a year. They have already raised about 200 million dollars so it is BIG. It is called EOS and is dubbed the “etherium killer” and is purely just a concept or what they say it will become….it is built for high speed transactions and does not have a transaction fee. I still dunno if this is what is being pitched but it does sound familiar.

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jimbo16
Member
jimbo16
August 16, 2017 8:46 am

The EOS website says this is day 48 of 351 so it will last almost a year. Problem i have with EOS is they are buying ERC20 tokens (Etherium) and at some point will convert them to the EOS platform that is being developed (pipedream….maybe) but wouldn’t that crash etherium? Also it is being developed by block.one who will own it…..you aren’t buying block.one and there are other concerns i have but as with all crypto there is an element of risk.

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Don
Guest
Don
August 17, 2017 4:22 am
Reply to  jimbo16

But this pitch claims the ico launches August 28th so it can’t be EOS

patmil
patmil
August 17, 2017 8:48 am
Reply to  jimbo16

There’s an interesting YouTube video talking about some of the concerns with EOS https://youtu.be/J4ArKHie9Lw

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archives2001
archives2001
August 19, 2017 10:17 am
Reply to  jimbo16

Jeff Berwick is pitching it bigtime!

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Tom
Member
Tom
August 15, 2017 8:11 pm

I noticed an ICO coming up for a crypto called Xcoin that I believe will have a relationship with gold. Interestingly Hutchinson’s pitch is called Project X.

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Craigers
Member
August 15, 2017 8:21 pm

Could be Viva Coin. They’ve structured their coin offering around a parallel economy that includes a compounding return to holders. It’s worth taking a look at while it’s still affordable. They ICO’d in early summer, so it’s in full-out development mode now.

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orokusaki
Member
orokusaki
August 15, 2017 8:28 pm

Travis, Thank you for digging into this, very insightful. I did read the crypto alert a couple days back and was wondering if it could it be HelloGold – gold backed tokens built on Ethereum blockchain, headquarted in Singapore. They have an app and about 5K users. Token sale starts on Aug 28 which matches the alert. Crowdsale is capped at 10 ETH per user, which is off though, https://www.hellogold.org/token-crowdsale.html

More links:
Announcement: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=2028134.new#new
Difference with Digix: https://medium.com/hellogold/hellogold-digix-whats-the-difference-fe633f2b69d8

Could you share your opinion on this please?

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rgolde
rgolde
August 15, 2017 8:45 pm

Cryptos are really in the wild wild west phase. They are unregulated and manipulated by someone with a lot of money as per this Zero Hedge article http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-08-06/mysterious-trader-nearly-unlimited-bankroll-said-be-manipulating-bitcoin-price
If you want something backed by gold, gold works just fine. Take delivery because if you don’t hold it you don’t own it. If you want to move your gold across borders I suppose One Gram would be a good way to do it.

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Theyo
Member
Theyo
August 15, 2017 8:47 pm

Hi Everyone, I was in the firing line of that teaser too, getting to the end an seeing the price I nearly fell off my seat, with all the Waffle, it took me a few hours to find the Treasure he was referring to, now listen carefully and follow through, I mean Check it out.
The ICO is uTrust, https://utrust.io/ it is all that he says, and the preICO’s price is very tempting and this is what is needed in the WORLD of crypto right now, This will change Everything.
I’m going as far in as I can afford, No need to thank me now, just pay it forward when you have the chance.

Best to all
Theyo

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orokusaki
Member
orokusaki
August 15, 2017 9:19 pm
Reply to  Theyo

https://utrust.io/faq

US citizens and residents are not allowed to participate in the ICO due to US Security Law restrictions.

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jimbo16
Member
jimbo16
August 15, 2017 10:06 pm
Reply to  orokusaki

Just about every ICO says not sold in the US etc due to SEC rules, that doesn’t stop anyone from using BTC or ETH held in any wallet. Just send crypto to the sale address and you can buy it. But do your homework, many are scams and a couple have had hackers steal your crypto by posting wrong address, you click send and poof your tokens are gone, forever.

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jimbo16
Member
jimbo16
August 15, 2017 10:28 pm
Reply to  Theyo

I did an initial review of the white paper (sort of like a prospectus) and utrust is referred to as “The future of online payments” and uses an internet API for transactions. I am sure Travis and this site uses some form of API for accepting payments on the internet. I don’t really see anything unique with this other than you can use crypto for purchases in leau of say VISA or MCard. It appears there is a 1% fee but it isn’t clear if the merchant pays the normal processing fees as normal so if so it makes transactions kinda expensive. There are 3-4 of these crypto credit cards out now (see TenX) with apparently many more coming. TenX issues a VISA card that you can spend crypto from etc. Been thinking about that one but with the number of these deals already it may be kinda of a crowded space….

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lozmel413
lozmel413
August 24, 2017 12:37 pm
Reply to  Theyo

How do you buy it?

Roxx
Guest
Roxx
August 25, 2017 2:36 pm
Reply to  Theyo

My research says you are right. Not open to US but how does US when one sends coins from one place to another?

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jimbo16
Member
jimbo16
August 25, 2017 5:12 pm
Reply to  Roxx

When you click send, they don’t ask where it came from…get it.

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Curt
Curt
August 15, 2017 9:18 pm

Some other clues in the teaser could lead one to look into Joel Monegro who joined with Chris Burniske to start Placeholder Capital. Follow this link to the article: https://www.cnbc.com/2017/07/13/ex-union-square-analyst-joel-monegro-starts-crypto-fund-placeholder.html

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SageNot
Guest
SageNot
August 15, 2017 9:32 pm

It can’t be gold. There isn’t ’nuff gold to back our dollar now, so how is it going t/b a world class coin? Why is the Federal Reserve so silent about this? I must be getting old, this makes little sense to me. BTW, why hasn’t gold taken off by now?

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macrobody
Member
macrobody
August 16, 2017 5:59 am
Reply to  SageNot

Of course it can. If you make every ounce of gold equal to $35.000 and every dollar in debt is backed by gold.

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jimbo16
Member
jimbo16
August 16, 2017 8:36 am
Reply to  macrobody

You going to sale or part with your gold for $35? Offer me $5000 and we will talk, maybe.

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oj1
Guest
oj1
August 25, 2017 10:24 am
Reply to  jimbo16

I believe that macrobody used the non-U.S. method of expressing money, with the period and comma having reverse meaning. Therefore, expressed in U.S. terms he meant $35,000. (In proofreading my reply I realized that this website’s built in editor changed my comma to a period and I had to go back and edit it to change it. So probably not macro’s fault). If you divide the amount of U.S. debt by the gold that it holds you get a big number. Even if you set a “reserve” percentage of 50% gold for every dollar of debt the value would be much higher than $5,000.

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jimbo16
Member
jimbo16
August 25, 2017 5:05 pm
Reply to  oj1

OK that makes more sense but….everyone writes the rest of the world is going to some gold backed currency and so forth…if so yes gold would need to rise a bunch. Problems are 2 fold, governments own something like 90% of the gold that exists in the world. Wouldn’t they just continue to manipulate the money supple? Secondly, with the hugh trade deficits the US runs wouldn’t we run out of gold within a decade? The numbers just don’t add up.

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jimbo16
Member
jimbo16
August 25, 2017 5:15 pm

Amen….this is why i love crypto.

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Angela
Irregular
Angela
August 15, 2017 9:50 pm

I hope not! A cryptocurrency in Sharia and Islamic Finance! I don’t care if the cost is $45 dollars and that gets me the equivalent of one gram of gold. What am I financing!

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pugmaster11
August 15, 2017 9:58 pm

Travis, my guess was Dimcoin……….ICO ends 8/27 and from a youtube video I heard a slight reference to one of the members being involved with an Australian project. Can’t get on the website because of possible SEC regulations, I think. When you read up on it with the NEM blockchain and the new way of doing economic activity, it seems a close match. What do you think? Why can’t the website be accessed?

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Dwayne
Member
Dwayne
August 15, 2017 10:16 pm

Travis, thanks for the analysis. I am certainly no expert but have been studying the whole thing quite a bit lately. I have two take aways from what I have seen so far. First, rightly or wrongly, cryptos are being perceived as safe havens like gold and silver. Look at most of the crypto charts from last week when the Korea thing was the headline. Record amounts of $$$ poured into cryptos and many hit all time highs. In fact, gold didnt move much last week when it normally would have, so MAYBE cryptos are perceived as more of a safe haven than gold (at least in the short term). Second, most of the cryptos I have looked at are micro, micro cap companies that are raising $$$ based on block chain and having to do with everything from Internet shopping to secure voting. So, it appears to me, at least very generally, that putting money into crypto is the millenial version of the stock market. These ‘coins’ are shares of stock. With all that said, I have poured over all the new ICOs I can find, and I don’t see anything that stands out as the Agora thing, so you might be right. And then again……………

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BlindBottle
BlindBottle
August 16, 2017 3:33 am
Reply to  Dwayne

That’s why I got into Bitcoin in the first place, it responded like a safe haven should in recent crises whereas Gold did not. Thank the central banks for breaking Gold.

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1manos
August 15, 2017 10:18 pm

Why it can’t be gold?
All you have to do is stop manipulation
Of Gold. =$10.000.00 and beyond
All problems solved!

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1manos
August 15, 2017 10:28 pm

Also let’s be realistic!
If bitcoins start offering gold as a back up
to legitimize their existence…………..
Think about it. What will happen to the dollar?
It will become Zimbabwe dollar no?
And…….at the same time what will happen to gold?
If any kind of bitcoin is introduced with gold backing, I think that the powers will step in and call it illegal
Because then bitcoin is money, so only the government
can issue money.
Bitcoin of any kind is worth what the people that trade and own it SAY is worth. That is what bitcoin is.
And it’s nones business or can do anything about.

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Andy
Member
Andy
August 15, 2017 11:02 pm

Could it be http://www.anthemgold.com ? Think it has an ICO later this year.
I invested in the company through bnktothefuture.com

Marc Pearsall
Guest
Marc Pearsall
August 15, 2017 11:07 pm

I actually think this is SafeCoin from the Maidsafe (Massive Array of Internet Disks, Secure Access For Everyone) network. You cant buy the safecoin yet but the Maidsafe coin is available from the usual Cryptocurrency exchanges and will be exchanged 1:1 when the SafeCoin (SAFE (Secure Access For Everyone) Network) network launches (perhaps on Aug 23???)
Good explanation on Wiki here: https://safenetwork.wiki/en/FAQ
Sounds like a gamechanger to me, but what do I know!

bmcm
Irregular
bmcm
August 16, 2017 9:23 am
Reply to  Marc Pearsall

SafeCoin looked interesting, but researching it, I came across this https://www.forbes.com/sites/kashmirhill/2014/06/03/mastercoin-maidsafe-crowdsale/#1909dcaa207d

Some very strange stuff going on, and a general warning about alt-coins…

Anyway, interesting though it is, SafeCoin doesn’t seem to match the “replace all the other cryptos” main message in the original newsletter pitch.

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Steve
Steve
August 15, 2017 11:15 pm

I luckily bought 6 bitcoin at 220. Very cautiously have invested/ speculated/ gambled into the cryptos. Still learning, but and also have gold, I am going to plow as much as I possibly can into cryptos. Have 9 now and have no intention to jump into the hype of anything replacing Bitcoin or gold. Not bragging, but I am dominating the crypto thing using 3 in momentum plays and treating 6 as investments. Good luck with any replacement hyperbole! There are more life changing/ICO’s coming…..

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Kaufmann98
Kaufmann98
August 16, 2017 12:52 am
Reply to  Steve

Where and how does one purchase these cryptos? Are there exchanges?

jimbo16
Member
jimbo16
August 16, 2017 10:28 am
Reply to  Kaufmann98

There are dozens…if you are in the US Kauf stick with a US exchange like Coinbase or Gemini….Kraken has locations now all over the world just to name a few.

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sundog88
sundog88
August 18, 2017 10:03 pm
Reply to  jimbo16
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manhattanmadman
manhattanmadman
August 21, 2017 10:38 am
Reply to  Kaufmann98

I’m using Coinbase to go from my bank account into either ETC or ETH.

Then I’m sending that over to either bittrex or liqui (exchanges) to trade other coins.

Anyone looking at SHX or DNT or anything else?

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Joe
Joe
August 15, 2017 11:27 pm

The august 28th date is what i cant confirm is what is bugging me

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